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Topic: "...let’s not do any of that!" Post ReplyPost New Topic
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Eric Sofer
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Posted: 04 February 2021 at 5:02pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

"Remember what we did to make Marvel great? Let's not do any of that!"

Since I'm not current on comics, I wonder if some folks would like to point out things that are happening that designed to not make Marvel great - and discuss what WOULD make Marvel great again. Not huge sweeping "The Living Tribunal sneezed" changes. But what would it take to get back to Mighty Marvel.

Of course, if you want to point out the same for DC, please do. How to get back to magnificent?
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Phillip L Lightfoot
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Posted: 04 February 2021 at 5:48pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

Erase the last 30 years or so. Just gone. Think about just how much garbage (Sins Past, etc.) just...disappears.
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Phil Frances
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Posted: 04 February 2021 at 5:52pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

Well, I'm no expert on current comics ... but ...

- "Re-unique" the characters ; get rid of the Red Hulks, Yellow Hulks, Spider-Gwens, Spider-Verse, 1,000,000 BC Avengers - more and more of the same idea just stops your core characters being special ;
- Stop trying to be the cinema ; comics are not the movies
- Bin the grim & gritty for good - and get us back to something more optimistic ; 
- Give us fabulous exploits and heroism, truly titanic battles and mayhem - but as fantasy grounded in realism, not some real world warzone.
- Marvel heroes have feet of clay, but not ( to paraphrase JB - I think ? ) all the way up to their necks. And stop twisting stuff so that 'authority' figures like Xavier or Reed or whoever else has to be some untrustworthy piece of work 
- Stop re-heating every previous idea and replaying it in some other hero's book
- For god's sake, kill the ***ing Phoenix off - else everyone on Earth will have had a turn before long
- Less 'Events' and more stories
- And bring back the fun there used to be.

All this applies to DC similarly ; there's probably a heap more I'm not even thinking of as yet, but there's my first shot.



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Michael Roberts
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Posted: 04 February 2021 at 6:29pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

I think modern music is objectively worse (or at least more boring), but there’s still a lot of stuff I do like. There’s nothing to be gained by resurrecting old bands or trying to roll back musical styles. I find the stuff that still connects with me, enjoy my old albums, and leave the trends that don’t interest me to the kids. 

I think 40-50 yo comic fans need to adopt the same attitude. 
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John Byrne
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Posted: 04 February 2021 at 6:58pm | IP Logged | 5 post reply

Restore the GRANDEUR!
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Scott Sackett
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Posted: 04 February 2021 at 7:10pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

For the writers:
Compress the storytelling, pack the issues with as much as possible.

For the artists:
Bring back the ideas taught in 'How to Draw Comics the Marvel Way" and require that all the characters be drawn on model. Require that the artists can draw a book in 4 weeks.

Gently remind all the staff and freelancers that the fans are the gasoline that fuels the industry.
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Peter Martin
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Posted: 04 February 2021 at 7:51pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Apply some of those wily, old golden rules:

  • Every issue is someone's first issue. Behave accordingly and cut them some slack
  • Return to the core aspects of the lead character and let the rest fall by the wayside
  • There is an alchemy that makes comics special: we can read people's thoughts;  we can see the action, but also have a narrator to zero us in on the most salient points or provide additional information; we have an infinite special effects budget; the action that lives in the gutters exists in the mind of the readers... Utilise these strengths
  • Make it relatable to real life, but bigger, better, more colourful and more fun than real life.   


Edited by Peter Martin on 04 February 2021 at 7:52pm
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Brian Floyd
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Posted: 04 February 2021 at 8:17pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

Fire and blacklist the fanboys and aspiring Hollywood writers. Or, at least, have an Editor-In-Chief and Editors who aren't fans of either.

This goes for both Marvel and DC, but DC had a major screw-up: When they did the Wonder Woman series with Donna, Alan Heinberg took his sweet time finishing the first storyarc, so they did fill-in issues, and released an Annual with the same villain that was in the (at that point) unfinished storyarc....and it was a completely different story, not the arc's continuation. Iirc, Diana was also back as WW by that Annual, as well.








Edited by Brian Floyd on 04 February 2021 at 8:22pm
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Christopher Frost
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Posted: 04 February 2021 at 9:32pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply

Simply put... tell good stories and resist the urge to reinvent the wheel.
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David Schmidt
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Posted: 05 February 2021 at 1:35am | IP Logged | 10 post reply

What I really disliked last time I read a Marvel current book is the pace. You had one story told in 10 boring issues. Of course at the end the book stoped and was relaunched with a new concept...

Elsewhen is really refreshing. I won't use this thread to flatter Mr Byrne and his great storytelling skills (oops I just did) but just look at what happened in 18 issues!

I won't spoil it for newcomers but you have it all: Action! Characters! Suspense at every corners!

That's what I always loved in super-hero comics. When you read Spider-Man or Fantastic Four comics you were in for a 20 pages or so ride!

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John Wickett
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Posted: 05 February 2021 at 2:10am | IP Logged | 11 post reply

I agree about the pace.  Stop writing "for the trades" and just tell the best story possible.

I don't know if erasing anything is the fix that's needed.  Somebody likes all the Spider characters, various Hulks, etc., because those books are among Marvel's best sellers.  I just choose to ignore them, and only buy what I like.

Eric, just out of curiosity, when was the last time Marvel was great in your opinion?  After the silver age, even when Marvel were at their best they put out a lot of crappy comics alongside the good stuff.  
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Steven Brake
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Posted: 05 February 2021 at 7:21am | IP Logged | 12 post reply

Limit the number of titles. Nothing wrong with a mini-series here or there, of course, but maybe just have something like:

Fantastic Four
The Amazing Spider-Man
The X-Men (or The Uncanny X-Men)
The Avengers
Captain America
Thor (or perhaps make this "Journey Into Mystery", an anthology book which can showcase the arcane aspect of the MU).
Iron Man
The Incredible Hulk
Marvel Team-Up or Two-In-One - or some kind of team up book, but genuinely rotational, not Spider-Man or the Thing teaming up with a different character each time.
What If?

What If, and MTU/MTOI would also be used as an opportunity to give a platform to new talent trying to break into the industry, or older hands struggling to find work in the industry. 

Limit "event" crossovers. Do decent stand-alone annuals, though.

Oh, and remember you're writing about heroes. Flawed heroes, yes. But heroes.

And you're not drawing a series of poses. You're meant to be illustrating characters and action.

And action. No "decompressed" stories, in which one page can have nine panels, with virtually nothing happening.

Colourful covers!

Excitement!

Cliffhangers!

And not having to have an in-depth knowledge of thirty years of endlessly re-written continuity in order to understand what's going on when you pick up an issue for the first time!
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