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Philippe Pinoli
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Joined: 03 September 2004
Location: France
Posts: 1256
Posted: 05 June 2020 at 8:28am | IP Logged | 1 post reply

My precious...
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Mark Haslett
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Joined: 19 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5361
Posted: 05 June 2020 at 8:42am | IP Logged | 2 post reply

Philippe: My precious...

***

We are not, all of us, made of the steel held within a certain Master of Bag
End! Not even our galactic Empresses!
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Michael Genitempo
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Joined: 04 July 2019
Location: United States
Posts: 408
Posted: 05 June 2020 at 8:51am | IP Logged | 3 post reply

I wonder what Xavier would think of all this... Something like: "please, not again?"
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Mark McKay
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Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 2145
Posted: 05 June 2020 at 8:57am | IP Logged | 4 post reply

Chris absolutely hated our resurrection of Jean Grey. Felt it damaged the Death of Phoenix story. The irony was, he'd revisited that particular well so many times--including using Dark Phoenix in the X-TITANS crossover!--that around the office she was called Marvel's least dead dead character!

That was what made bringing Jean back possible. The Death of Phoenix had been so diluted we knew only a few readers would be likely to complain. Most would be glad just to have Jean back.

(If I'd known what would subsequently be DONE with her, I would not have been so quick to bring her back!!)

Is it fair to say that he shared the same frustrations as you in other scenarios, in that a different editorial department was doing a story with an X-Men character?

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Richard Palmgren
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Joined: 31 May 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 320
Posted: 05 June 2020 at 9:11am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

As I'm gearing up for all things Jean and Phoenix, including reading Uncanny 108 a billion times and the Hidden Years Phoenix appearance, a quick question:

Had Hidden Years continued, would you have included more Phoenix appearances as The Phoenix stalked Jean?
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Michael Penn
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Joined: 12 April 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 11492
Posted: 05 June 2020 at 9:13am | IP Logged | 6 post reply

X-MEN #137 caught me by surprise. I did not expect Jean
Grey to die. Can't be! I was a longtime reader with great
affection for the (my) original X-Men.The finale
had to be some way to save her. Had to! Can't doom one of
the originals! Can they? They can! I will not deny that
#137 was masterful. It surely was. A top issue of any
comicbook, ever. But I felt like the X-men themselves and
the comic itself were "damaged" after that. For me,
irreparably, it turned out.

Of course, I'd not discerned any hint Phoenix and Jean
Grey were different. Would I have accepted her return
later? As it was explained. Yes. Sure. Jean Grey would be
back! Unfortunately, since -- again, for me -- the X-MEN
comicbook went quickly and majorly off the rails after JB
left, by the time Jean did come back... eh, so what?

(Full disclosure: I'd long stopped reading comicbooks by
that point. I only learned of how Jean came back decades
after the fact.)
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James Woodcock
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Joined: 21 September 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 6490
Posted: 05 June 2020 at 9:35am | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Majesty.

Just noticed that today. Nice
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Vinny Valenti
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Joined: 17 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 7403
Posted: 05 June 2020 at 10:08am | IP Logged | 8 post reply

Apparently Chris invented "Majestrix". I just Googled the term and the first match is Lilandra!
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Vinny Valenti
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Joined: 17 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 7403
Posted: 05 June 2020 at 10:13am | IP Logged | 9 post reply

"Yeah, I remember that the "Uncanny X-Men" title
took some time before even acknowledging that Jean
Grey had returned."

--

I was just turning 12 years old at the time FF#286/X-FACTOR#1 came out. But even then I got a sense of the internal fighting of the creative teams, with as you mentioned, X-MEN seeming to bend waaaay over backwards to not acknowledge that Jean had returned. As a reader I could tell that the stalling was deliberate. It took 3 years! (Or in Claremontian Time, the average subplot).
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John Byrne
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Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 126532
Posted: 05 June 2020 at 10:25am | IP Logged | 10 post reply

Apparently Chris invented "Majestrix". I just Googled the term and the first match is Lilandra!

•••

One of the odder ones. Known for his “strong women,” Chris coins a feminized diminutive for Lilandra.

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Mark Haslett
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Joined: 19 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5361
Posted: 05 June 2020 at 11:00am | IP Logged | 11 post reply

Michael: I will not deny that
#137 was masterful. It surely was. A top issue of any
comicbook, ever. But I felt like the X-men themselves and
the comic itself were "damaged" after that. For me,
irreparably, it turned out.

**

The accidental part of creating X-Men 137 is really interesting -- there
really is little to accurately compare it to.

Something about being 12 issues into Elsewhen is really bringing that fact
home to me.
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John Byrne
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Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 126532
Posted: 05 June 2020 at 11:13am | IP Logged | 12 post reply

The Death of Phoenix being an “accident” is something too many people forget. You really can’t wake up one morning thinking you’re going to pull off something like that.

Sadly, too many people think they can do exactly that, and thus we end up with modern Marvel.

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