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Brian Rhodes
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Posted: 22 October 2019 at 8:45am | IP Logged | 1 post reply

...I really just hate The Doobie Brothers, but assumed they were already in because it seems any drippy 60's act is in. 

I'm not sure what is meant by "drippy", but they certainly weren't a 60's act. 

...which reminds me, an unspoken oversight of the Rock Hall is that Jim Steinman isn't in. 

Agreed. Though, oversight is kind of their jam. 


Edited by Brian Rhodes on 22 October 2019 at 8:45am
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Brian Floyd
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Posted: 22 October 2019 at 1:41pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

Since Styx was mentioned, I've been thinking: If they're ever inducted, will they yet Dennis DeYoung perform with them? There seems to be some bad blood, and its on the rest of the band's side. He was fired because he wanted to continue peforming dated material, and has been performing as "Dennis DeYoung, featuring the music of Styx", while the band moved on without him. He's been open to a reunion for years, but it hasn't happened.

Steve Perry didn't perform with Journey when they were inducted, but that is an entirely different scenario. (And Journey without Perry is more or less a cover band.)





Edited by Brian Floyd on 22 October 2019 at 1:42pm
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Brian Miller
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Posted: 22 October 2019 at 1:44pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

I don't think Styx would perform with DeYoung. 

I think Journey has gotten over any bad blood they had back when it all went down. I'm wondering if Perry didn't sing with them because he actually couldn't. At least not in the way he did when he was with them. 
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Brian Floyd
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Posted: 22 October 2019 at 1:51pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

I think any bad blood is more on Perry's side. He was still recovering from a skiing accident he declined to have surgery for, and was either fired or quit. But you're probably on to something about why he didn't perform with them. He's still great, but probably can't hit or sustain the higher notes any more.

And Styx without DeYoung is a cover band, too. Forgot to mention that.


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Brian Miller
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Posted: 22 October 2019 at 3:53pm | IP Logged | 5 post reply

Ha! I was wondering why one was and the other wasn't. 
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Shawn Kane
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Posted: 23 October 2019 at 4:50am | IP Logged | 6 post reply

While I don't completely disagree with Brian's point about Styx being a cover band without Dennis DeYoung, my favorite Styx songs are Renegade and Blue Collar Man so Tommy Shaw still being in the band makes them more legit to me than a band like Lynyrd Skynyrd or Foreigner who only have one original member but not the lead vocalist. Where do you draw the line? REO Speedwagon joke about their drummer and guitar player being the new guys who have been in the band for over 30 years.
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Brian Miller
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Posted: 23 October 2019 at 8:32am | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Renegade is totally their best song. I do dig Too Much Time On My Hands and Mr Roboto, tho. 
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Shawn Kane
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Posted: 23 October 2019 at 8:53am | IP Logged | 8 post reply

I love Too Much Time On My Hands as well, Brian!

Lynyrd Skynyrd is my best example of a cover band while being allowed to keep the name but it made me think: At What Point Does A "Classic" Band Become A "Cover" Band?

Is it the loss of a vocalist like Skynyrd, Styx, Journey, Foreigner, Chicago, etc...?*

If one original member is still in the band, take Mick Jones of Foreigner, but that member is technically the band leader, is the band still legit. As a kid, it used to bug me that Tony Iommi was continuing Black Sabbath with what seemed to be a different vocalist every album but he later stated that he was mandated by the record company to call them Black Sabbath albums instead of Tony Iommi solo projects.

Deep Purple without Ritchie Blackmore and John Lord certainly doesn't feel like Deep Purple but with Ian Gillan's vocals, it sure sounds like them. So are they a cover band these days even though Don Airey and Steve Morse have been in the band for years? How is it any different from the other Marks?

*Loss of a vocalist is usually a big deal to me, Van Halen without DLR and Anthrax without Joey Belladonna still made good albums but they didn't feel like Van Halen and Anthrax to me. On the other hand there's AC/DC....

On a Hall Fame related note, I've previously mentioned that I feel Motorhead should include Campbell, Wurzel, and Dee. Were Eric Carr, Bruce Kulick, and Eric Singer included with Kiss? I thought it was just Stanley, Simmons, Frehley, and Criss. Of course, it makes an argument for Vinnie Vincent and Mark St. John who preceded Kulick, I guess.


Edited by Shawn Kane on 23 October 2019 at 8:56am
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Brian Miller
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Posted: 23 October 2019 at 10:40am | IP Logged | 9 post reply

KISS was just the four founding members. 
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Shawn Kane
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Posted: 23 October 2019 at 11:17am | IP Logged | 10 post reply

I guess I can see both sides of the argument. The band that made Destroyer, Love Gun, and Alive! isn't the same group that did Lick It Up, Asylum, and Revenge but those are still part of the legacy of Kiss and were still relevant in their time.
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Mark Haslett
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Posted: 23 October 2019 at 1:48pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply

I think the question about when a band stops being the band is a fascinating one, with so many different answers.

In my mind, the loss of a key band-member is like an existential trial and the world is somehow the judge/jury. It's the "strength of the case" in this metaphor that matters.

AC/DC made a strong case and the world allowed it.

Van Halen made a strong case and half the world allowed it.

The Doors made a weak case and the world didn't buy it.

Journey made a novel case and the world didn't really buy it either.

Lots of variables go into the "case". But this scheme seems to make room for all the different ways bands pass through this kind of challenge.
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Brian Rhodes
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Posted: 23 October 2019 at 2:04pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

KISS was inducted with just the original four. 


I guess what is in question is what "makes" the band. David Lee Roth had a unique sound, but the band was called "Van Halen", after all. And the music, specifically Eddie's guitar, was a big part of their appeal. 

Similar to AC/DC. Bon Scott was one-of-a-kind. But Brian Johnson brought something else to the mix. But still, the music was undeniably AC/DC. 

In both cases, the bands actually became more popular with their new singers, with unprecedented albums sales and chart positions. 

I feel like Styx without Dennis DeYoung is not Styx, though. Same with Journey and Perry. 


Bringing it back around to KISS. The "magic" the original four had is undeniable. That said...Gene and Paul were always the main songwriters and vocalists. Has every iteration of the band since Peter Criss first quit been a tribute version? At this point, Eric Singer has spent far more total time with the band than Frehley or Criss ever did. 



Edited by Brian Rhodes on 23 October 2019 at 2:05pm
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