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Jason Czeskleba Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 30 April 2004 Posts: 4548
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Posted: 20 November 2019 at 11:21pm | IP Logged | 1
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QUOTE:
Walls are closing fast for Trump. |
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As far as proving he engaged in impeachable offenses, yes. As far as moving towards experiencing any sort of direct consequence for that, no. At this point, only a small majority of the American people (and almost no Republicans) believe that what he did was an impeachable offense. Unless more people become convinced of that, then nothing is going to come of all this. Republican congresspeople will simply continue to either profess Trump's innocence (despite the facts) or say that what he did isn't that big a deal. And the Senate will vote for acquittal.
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Marc Baptiste Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 June 2004 Location: United States Posts: 3655
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Posted: 21 November 2019 at 2:16am | IP Logged | 2
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Death, taxes, and a REPUBLICAN Senate acquitting President Trump, if that's where this ends up.
Marc
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Brian Miller Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004 Location: United States Posts: 30902
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Posted: 21 November 2019 at 6:26am | IP Logged | 3
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Basically, the Republican controlled senate now says it's ok for a sitting US president, regardless of party, to use US aid to a foreign country in exchange for personal political favors. And if this does come up in a future administration, certainly this instance will be used as precedent
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Brian Miller Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004 Location: United States Posts: 30902
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Posted: 21 November 2019 at 6:27am | IP Logged | 4
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Meanwhile, yesterday Trump claimed credit for opening a new Apple manufacturing plant in Texas. That’s been there for 6 years.
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Greg McPhee Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 August 2004 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 5065
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Posted: 21 November 2019 at 6:38am | IP Logged | 5
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If (or when) Trump gets away with this, he's going to be like Godzilla stomping over Tokyo.
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Rebecca Jansen Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 February 2018 Location: Canada Posts: 4542
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Posted: 21 November 2019 at 12:40pm | IP Logged | 6
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I can see it taking shape watching the live feed yesterday where Trump is allowed to just scrape by yet again thanks to the corruption supporting him and the decent being driven off, vilified, repelled, outright terminated for no reason (probably a week before qualifying for a pension plan). :^(
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Peter Martin Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 March 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 15812
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Posted: 21 November 2019 at 12:58pm | IP Logged | 7
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I think Trump knows that time is on his side. The longer the process drags on, the less its impact. The more people subconsciously accept what happened or simply just stop caring.
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Rebecca Jansen Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 February 2018 Location: Canada Posts: 4542
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Posted: 21 November 2019 at 1:07pm | IP Logged | 8
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Slip slide and away, especially if the other side distracts itself with grand plans for the best healthcare ever (and it would be so easy and pay for itself, that I can tell you, believe them), even ending all hunger and poverty, plus subsidizing higher educations or some unspecified general sort etc.
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Kevin Brown Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 31 May 2005 Location: United States Posts: 8846
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Posted: 21 November 2019 at 1:10pm | IP Logged | 9
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If Trump gets away with his corruption, I then fear for the election in 2020. The GOP will then be emboldened and could easily legislate the results as they see fit, especially if the voting is very close. The states are actually under no obligation to follow the votes of the people. It says so in the Constitution in Article II, Section 1, Clause 2: Each State shall appoint, in such Manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a Number of Electors, equal to the whole Number of Senators and Representatives to which the State may be entitled in the Congress: but no Senator or Representative, or Person holding an Office of Trust or Profit under the United States, shall be appointed an Elector.
Republican held legislatures in such states as, say, Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin could easily say the electoral votes go to Trump even if the majority of the people voted for the Dem candidate. The Governors (who are all Democrats in those states) have zero say in the matter.
Now then, it probably be political suicide for them to do that and, of course, there would be numerous lawsuits filed, BUT, unfortunately, there is precedence.... Bush v. Gore. The Supreme Court wrote: “There are a few exceptional cases in which the Constitution imposes a duty or confers a power on a particular branch of a State’s government. This is one of them.” By using that "logic", I can easily see a number of states' legislatures gearing up.
So Trump definitely needs to be impeached and tossed from office. Otherwise, the 2020 elections will probably turn into a bloodbath.
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Marc Baptiste Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 June 2004 Location: United States Posts: 3655
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Posted: 21 November 2019 at 3:59pm | IP Logged | 10
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Article II, Section 1, Clause 2 of the US Constitution; even MORE proof, along with the Electoral College itself, that the Founders absolutely did NOT want the people electing the President.
Marc
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David Miller Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004 Posts: 3009
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Posted: 21 November 2019 at 9:57pm | IP Logged | 11
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It's a shame the 1800 debacle led to ticketed election of the president and vice president, because as originally conceived, impeachment and removal from office would have elevated the electoral runner-up to the presidency. The 12th Amendment neutered impeachment by keeping in place the same corrupt administration.
(I've read contemporaneous debates on the then-proposed amendment from Congress and several state legislatures, and so far haven't found any evidence the consequences for impeachment were raised by anybody; legislators were primarily concerned with avoiding the agony of another protracted Electoral College deadlock.)
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Rebecca Jansen Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 February 2018 Location: Canada Posts: 4542
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Posted: 21 November 2019 at 10:18pm | IP Logged | 12
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"... keeping in place the same corrupt administration."
I think that wasn't the case at one time, as Andrew Johnson was radically different in every way politically from Abe Lincoln. Johnson must still be one of the all-time worst presidents undoing every effect of the civil war he could.
I think the Trump enablers are going to keep fanning their own smoke about Hunter Biden, and the always sung unfair process song, and enough people will be just confused enough by it to be 'don't know' or 'both sides are bad' people... drum up that apathy!
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