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Shaun Barry
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Posted: 02 November 2019 at 9:41pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply


Greg Kirkman:  Fun at parties.



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Peter Martin
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Posted: 02 November 2019 at 10:34pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

Never mind that action movies that don’t star a DC or Marvel character are a hard sell these days.
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This I can't get behind. But, more importantly, I do back the rest of what you said, Michael. When T2 came out, Arnie said the movie industry was screwed, because that film had it all. He wasn't right about the film industry, but he was right about picking both the high point of his career and the Terminator franchise.

Number one problem: all the films have been worse than the first two films.

Number two problem: people don't really care all that much about this franchise.

Number three problem: the one with Christian Bale was FUCKING AWFUL!!!!

I'm not too wrought up in this at all and therefore may be misising something, but I don't see the 'woke' stuff playing a part in the failure of this installment at the box office (so far).
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Brian Hague
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Posted: 03 November 2019 at 1:38am | IP Logged | 3 post reply

The only thing I've heard from anyone about this picture is how Linda Hamilton hasn't aged well. While I actually don't agree with that, no one apparently wanted to see an action film that starred a woman who looks remarkably like my sister's mother-in-law. 

Greg Kirkman wrote: "All I can say is "Get woke, go broke."

Yes, Greg. We know. That is literally ALL you can say anymore. 

This film was brought down by the string of interest-killing lousy movies that preceded it, all promising story content they didn't deliver. The Alien franchise is the same at this point. An all-white cast with everyone eating at Chick-Fil-A and shooting anyone waving a rainbow flag in the head wouldn't have helped sales on this film.

Except maybe in your little circle of friends.

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James Woodcock
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Posted: 03 November 2019 at 1:40am | IP Logged | 4 post reply

I would suggest fatigue & lack of trust in an underperforming franchise have far more to do with these numbers than ‘Go woke’.

I’m actually surprised the first two Terminator films (or Alien & Aliens for that matter) are accepted by you Greg. Because, bar those four films, you really seem to have problems with female, & especially non-white male, led films/stories.

It is not pleasant to watch
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Brian Hague
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Posted: 03 November 2019 at 2:00am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

I can see the interest Greg's crowd would have in those films. The minority member of the crew and the other woman die on cue in Alien and Ripley gives good fan service in her scanties. In the second one, Vasquez never moves to the fore and is killed, suitably punished for being Mexican. Linda Hamilton in Terminator is terrified throughout, running to men for help, & getting them all killed before she's capable of stepping up herself. And in Terminator II, the events of the previous film have driven her insane with anger and paranoia. Only as a crazy person can she have agency in her own film.

Everybody stays in their respective boxes except the heroines, and they are largely disregarded, compromised by their emotions and paranoia.

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David Miller
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Posted: 03 November 2019 at 2:51am | IP Logged | 6 post reply


 QUOTE:
If they hired specifically for skin pigmentation or gender, the film would have been good? Why would that matter? Terminator 2 was written by two white guys, and directed by one. Is it a bad film because the writing staff didn't reflect the protagonist's gender?

I have not seen the movie or followed anything about it, but the main protagonist in the first three films were women and nobody cared. What changed in this new movie?

The white guy monopoly on a 30 year-old sequel is beside the point to a movie released in 2019. Dark Fate is a bad film because it's boring and predictable. (I spent a lot of the movie reciting dialogue before the characters said it.) Plus the production design -- by a woman -- is listless and uninspired. It looks cheap. I was astonished by its reported $185 million budget.

Racial or gender diversity in the writing or direction could have improved the portrayal of Mexican culture, for example, or brought a little reality to the female characters. Linda Hamilton's transformation into a badass in 1991 may have been groundbreaking for its time, but it was still a man's ideal of a badass woman. Captain Marvel was hardly a great film, but important elements, such as the depth of Carol Danver's friendship with Maria Rambeau, the title character's revolt against her male superior's arbitrary and condescending expectations, and her enjoyment in redesigning her costume, clearly reflected female concerns and a female perspective. (And I'm as woke as they come, yet I still come across as a clod just talking about it.)

Nothing actually prevents men from reflecting female point of view -- literally nothing, since despite the woke jihad approximately 100% of studio feature films are written and directed by men -- but it's pretty obvious when men are paying lip service without empathy or understanding, as it is in Dark Fate.

Part of the point of diversity is to bring new perspectives. I'm saying, bring new perspectives.
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Joe Zhang
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Posted: 03 November 2019 at 7:03am | IP Logged | 7 post reply

I can't get myself to watch this, even if it turns out to be a good movie. Too many reboots or revivals over the years. And the one that won fan approval, the Fox T.V. show, was cancelled on a cliffhanger. 

Edited by Joe Zhang on 03 November 2019 at 7:03am
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Koroush Ghazi
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Posted: 03 November 2019 at 4:02pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

Is an action/slasher film series about a dystopian future featuring murderous cyborgs really the right vehicle for ham-fisted cash-grabbing attempts at being seen to pander to often self-servingly overblown concerns regarding sexism and/or racism?

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Brian Floyd
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Posted: 06 November 2019 at 1:14pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply

Genisys should have been the final film. It was a fitting ending for the franchise.
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Vinny Valenti
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Posted: 07 November 2019 at 2:41pm | IP Logged | 10 post reply

So was TERMINATOR 2, but they just couldn't leave well enough alone.

I've said before that a way to do TERMINATOR 3 could have been to bring Arnold back as the evil Terminator and primary antagonist - and maybe make him even more vicious than in the original. And hope against hope, not have this be spoiled before the movie release this time around*.It would have gone against Arnold's image at that point, but that would have been the point.

*It blew my mind when it was pointed out that if you try to watch T2 with a clean slate, it's actually not until Arnold says "Get Down" in the mall that it's clear that he, and not Robert Patrick in cop uniform, is the GOOD guy.
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