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Topic: Q for JB Val Kilmer as Batman Post ReplyPost New Topic
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Brian Hague
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Posted: 30 April 2019 at 3:52am | IP Logged | 1 post reply

I've long felt that the lower half of Kilmer's face was too minimal and pointed to effectively convey a sense of "Batman" being in that cowl. There were frequently scenes wherein he and Chris O'Donnell's Robin appeared to be of similar ages. I read a review recently that said that there is a lot more Jim Carrey in that movie than you may recall, and I'm reluctant to revisit it for that reason, among others.

My favorite line made at the film's expense comes from Peter David who said that Tommy Lee Jones pulled off the remarkable trick of making Two-Face one-note.

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Vinny Valenti
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Posted: 30 April 2019 at 7:00am | IP Logged | 2 post reply

Wow, you jogged my memory of being excited to hear that Tommy Lee Jones was going to play Two-Face. "Disappointment" is an understatement.
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Vinny Valenti
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Posted: 30 April 2019 at 7:01am | IP Logged | 3 post reply

"I've long felt that the lower half of Kilmer's face was too minimal and pointed to effectively convey a sense of "Batman" being in that cowl."

Jon Hamm and his square jaw was made for a superhero movie. What a missed opportunity.
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Peter Martin
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Posted: 30 April 2019 at 9:01am | IP Logged | 4 post reply

Didn't like the news of Kilmer's casting way back when, but he gave an acceptable performance -- as Petter said, the movie had much bigger problems. Tommy Lee Jones seemed to think he should play Two-Face as if he was some kind of derivative of the Joker, laughing maniacally at everything. Jim Carrey's choice of how to play the Riddler was quintessential 90s Jim Carrey... Totally over the top without any ounce of restraint and more Jim Carrey than Edward Nygma. Batman/Bruce Wayne in comparison was pretty good, as was Nicole Kidman as Chase Meridian. But those villains ruined it. The villains in the Burton films unbalanced things, but at least the villains were interesting to watch! Two-Face and the Riddler were truly terrible in Batman Forever.

Of course, Batman and Robin makes the film look like a masterpiece in comparison.


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Brian Hague
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Posted: 30 April 2019 at 1:08pm | IP Logged | 5 post reply

I maintain that Batman Forever does have the best Jim Carrey line ever when he says, "If knowledge is power... THEN A... GOD... AM... I!!!"  and then follows it up with, "Was that over the top? I'm never sure."

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Brian Floyd
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Posted: 30 April 2019 at 8:28pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

BATMAN FOREVER is only movie of those four that I rarely ever watch. I've seen it *maybe* 5 times total. (BATMAN RETURNS is the one I've watched the most.)

Tommy Lee Jones was a waste as Two-Face, and must've either paid off a favor or really needed the check. They should have stuck with Billy Dee Williams.

Jim Carrey was completely wrong for the Riddler, and would've been a better choice for one of Batman's more insane villains. Riddler isn't really crazy other than having a fixation on riddles and puzzles. The costumes didn't help, either. Why the red hair and makeup mask instead of an actual mask? And the less said about the outfit he wore at the end, the better....

Joel Schumacher wasn't a great choice for director, either. I'm a fan of some of his other work, but didn't care for him on either Batman film, though I think he did a better job directing BATMAN AND ROBIN.
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Matthew Wilkie
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Posted: 01 May 2019 at 5:29am | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Kilmer acted like all of his scenes were shot at 3am with only 90 minutes of sleep.

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With the exception of Tombstone, this could be equally posted in a thread about every movie he's ever been in.

***

Arguably Tombstone was the one role that he needed to look like he had only had 90 minutes of sleep.
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Brian Hague
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Posted: 01 May 2019 at 3:02pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

Brian Floyd wrote: "Jim Carrey was completely wrong for the Riddler, and would've been a better choice for one of Batman's more insane villains. Riddler isn't really crazy other than having a fixation on riddles and puzzles."

Have you not seen Frank Gorshin in the role? I put in a Batman disc once just to freak out my then-17-year old nephew with the wildness of Gorshin's performance. Mission accomplished.

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Brian Floyd
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Posted: 01 May 2019 at 10:38pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply

After Caesar Romero's Joker, Gorshin's Riddler is my second favorite villain from the 60's show. Julia Newmar's Catwoman would be up there with them had she stuck around and not been replaced by Earha Kitt. (And I'd like to forget John Astin took over as the Riddler for a story.)

Gorshin's Riddler was more evil than outright crazy, other than that laugh. Jim Carrey's Riddler was too over the top, and most definitely nuts.

Also, on the Kilmer front, he has done a few good films: TOMBSTONE, THE SAINT, TOP GUN, THE REAL MCCOY.....(And TOP SECRET is a guilty pleasure.)

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Brian Hague
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Posted: 01 May 2019 at 10:55pm | IP Logged | 10 post reply

I agree that Carrey took it too far and that the script was not on the character's side at all. Gorshin's Riddler still seems vaguely crazed to me. Something about that guy is just not right.

Julie Newmar is unquestionably a force of nature poured into an agreeably shaped catsuit, but I liked what Eartha Kitt did with the role as well. That voice of her's was like nothing else and absolutely perfect for a cat-themed villainess. 

Where I most keenly feel the absence of Julie Newmar is in the Batman film. Lee Meriwether is fine, but there is nothing intrinsically catlike about her character or performance, unlike the other two. She feels like a generic placeholder keeping Newmar's spot in line open for her.

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Paul Kimball
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Posted: 03 May 2019 at 4:23pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply

IMO, Clooney would make a better Wonder Man than Batman.

____________
Agreed but I think he would fit even better as Paladin.
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Andrew Saxon
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Posted: 04 May 2019 at 3:53am | IP Logged | 12 post reply

Just got to step in and defend Lee Meriwether's performance as Catwoman in the 1966 Bat-movie. Lee deserves far better than to be described as a placeholder for Julie Newmar.  I thought Lee was terrific and more than held her own in a room with Gorshin, Meredith and Romero. Now, Julie Newmar will most likely always be my favourite Catwoman, but she was not as good an actress as Meriwether, and I don't think she would have pulled off the dual role of Miss Kitka quite so well. I actually tend to think it was just as well Julie was unavailable for the picture. If you don't think there is anything intrinsically cat-like about Lee's performance as Catwoman then you need to go and watch the movie again (not hardship as far as I'm concerned, it's still my favourite Batman film). Julie was my favourite TV Catwoman but Lee was absolutely my favourite movie Catwoman.
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