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Stephen Churay
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Posted: 10 January 2019 at 3:22pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

Ok, I realize that many here aren't
religious. About 70% of Americans identify
as Christian. DC doesn't want the headache
of a comic containing racist stereotypes
that can be put it a historical context,
but has NO TROUBLE releasing a book called
THE SECOND COMING, showing Jesus rooming
with a superhero in the new Vertigo line.

There's no historical context for the
hypocrisy, its in vad taste right now. I
don't understand how one is ok, but the
other, not so much.

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Michael Roberts
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Posted: 10 January 2019 at 3:41pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

Iíd be opposed to any depictions of untrue stereotypes that painted all Christians with the same brush. I think their mythology should be treated equally with all other mythologies. If Thor as a superhero is alright, then so is Jesus as a superhero. 
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Joseph Greathouse
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Posted: 10 January 2019 at 3:50pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

"There's no historical context for the 
hypocrisy, its in vad taste right now. I 
don't understand how one is ok, but the 
other, not so much."

I think its pretty easy. One has the potential of bringing bad press to a large-scale movie investment, thereby having a possible negative impact on costing the company money.

The other does not.

As business decisions go, it could easily be worth their while to determine how the film does and if it indeed becomes a franchise before they determine whether releasing such a collection would be profitable. 
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Brian Hague
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Posted: 10 January 2019 at 6:22pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

David, I'll buy that. I haven't read those issues focusing on Ebony in that way, so yes, justifying a racist depiction and then doubling down on it sounds pretty beyond the pale... so to speak.

Greg Kirkman wrote: "So, I askólegitimately, not because I actually have an ďanswerĒ and am therefore trying to offer a rebuttal to your statementówhere is that line drawn? What makes some product-of-their-time books okay to keep in publication, and others not? Granted, Golden Age comics may not be at quite the same literary level as Mark Twain, but..."

Where is line drawn? Back there, behind us. We're past it now.

If DC were to reprint the Monster Society chapters as is, they would literally be repeating the mistakes of yesterday and profiting from the racist depiction of the races therein. One of the oft-cited reasons for keeping these things alive to avoid repeating those mistakes. And yet you argue that we should, what, perpetuate them now so there are less of them in the future? Or should we just, y'know, see the humor of them and be cool with it? Do you find Steamboat and Nippo funny?

Why should a black kid who enjoys the Shazam film pick up a book and find the very same subservient mushmouf stereotype that his grandparents were subjected to? Because you think it's of historical interest? You get to make that determination for him? How wise of you. How learned.

It's odd that in recent threads correspondents complain of or are warned against saying things that might paint them as racists or homophobes. God forbid anyone here should suffer being mis-characterized. 

Why, it's almost as if the manner in which people are presented in public mattered or something...

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Eric Jansen
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Posted: 10 January 2019 at 8:06pm | IP Logged | 5 post reply

Kids aren't going to buy $50 or $100 hardcover reprints of Golden Age material--that's strictly middle-aged longtime fan territory.  I think 40 or 50 year-olds can read something in its proper historical context without it being an affirmation of thoughtless racist imagery.  Again, a disclaimer or well-written intro not only mollifies the issue, it gives the opportunity to speak against mistakes of the past.
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Brian Hague
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Posted: 10 January 2019 at 8:18pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

Should we limit the print run as well, Eric? Have the book appear only in certain venues? How limited should this now-no-longer mass market edition be? Because we don't want to sell it to casual buyers who might simply open it up and start reading, right? 

Or are we still selling it in as many shops and Barnes and Noble locations as we can? The intro will mollify a certain portion of the buying public, but there we still be those who come to the property cold and will be surprised, even perhaps, if its still permissible, offended by what they find inside. Well, their fault, right? Should have read the introduction first. 

Or, y'know, here's a wacky thought... we could just reprint some non-racist Captain Marvel stories and sell it everyone. How about that?

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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 10 January 2019 at 10:44pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

I get what youíre saying Brian. 

As noted, I donít have an answer. Speaking only for myself, of course, I just donít like the idea of censorship and suppression and whitewashing of history. It doesnít sit well with me. As a (Hopefully!) rational adult, I can pick up such a book and view it with the proper historical context. Try to learn from it. Get a sense of history, with all of its ugly truth laid bare. 

I know that the same canít be said for everyone, and that there are considerations to be had for both children and for those who would legitimately (and quite reasonably) take offense. Itís obviously a delicate matter, and I donít have an answer. But I think itís important not to lose sight of history, so as not to repeat it. Does reprinting history mean repeating it? I I donít know.

I read some time ago that a controversial, scholarly reprinting of Mein Kampf sold like hotcakes in Germany, and opened up a big can of legal and moral questions.
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David Miller
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Posted: 10 January 2019 at 11:00pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

Yeah, I discovered The Big Red Cheese through the decidedly non-racist story reprinted in The Smithsonian Book of Comic Book Comics. I was shocked by Steamboat when I read Monster Society of Evil a few year later. Fawcett published hundreds of Captain Marvel stories, and it wouldn't be difficult to assemble a fat best-of volume that was largely pickaninny-free. 

And I wish DC would. The Archives are out of print, and chronologically reprinting the earliest, crudest stories was a pointless and self-defeating exercise, anyway. 

Whoah, this is interesting. In 1950, Fawcett published a book called NEGRO ROMANCE COMICS. I was expecting to be horrified, but...


 
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Brian Hague
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Posted: 10 January 2019 at 11:16pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply

Greg, hopefully you can see that this is not censorship, not suppression, and does not involve the whitewashing of history. History is as it occurred. Nothing has been erased. The comics involved are still widely discussed. The copyright situation being what it is, the stories are even available online, so it's not a case of anything being kept hidden from the public.

It is a publisher deciding that material designed for popular entertainment, specifically the enjoyment of children, no longer meets that requirement in modern times. The same is largely true of Song of the South for that matter. Like the Monster Society, it was put back into print some time ago and deemed commercially non-viable afterwards. Those reissued versions are still out there. Disney hasn't demanded their return to their warehouses under criminal penalty. The government hasn't stepped in to make certain they never see the light of day again. Nothing is being censored.

Another cycle of copies released today would likely not make money, especially not when balanced against the amount of press necessary to offset the attendant criticism. Even if it did make money, the product would still be something ugly. 

It is gratifying to hear you say that offense can still be a legitimate and reasonable reaction. Largely your arguments to date seem to characterize offense as a tool being used by horrid SJW's to attack fans and deprive society of its most treasured cultural holdings. 

As for the question of whether reprinting it means repeating it, yes, it does, with a newly assigned UPC code right there on the cover to ensure that the cash goes right into the DC and book seller's coffers. Is DC then in the business of selling pictures of racist caricatures; rubbery lips the shape of inner tubes, slanty devil eyes and buck teeth? DC has decided they aren't. 

It's strange that so many think they should be.


Edited by Brian Hague on 10 January 2019 at 11:17pm
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Eric Jansen
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Posted: 11 January 2019 at 6:22am | IP Logged | 10 post reply

The first big comic book epic?  Yeah, I'd like to see it.

It's full of racist imagery?  Well, how bad is it?  How much is there?  That's sort of the point.  I'll never know.  Somebody else has decided for me that it's best I not see it.

But it HAS been reprinted already though, right?  In the Archives.  I guess I can go track those down sometime.  Expensive hardcovers that probably only middle-aged adults bought.  The material is out there, and nothing happened.  No big outcry, no children crying on the national news.

I'm reading Hemingway's "To Have And Have Not" right now, for the first time.  Well, the book Harry Morgan is a far cry from Bogart's charming movie version.  The book has racist utterances all the way through, from Harry.  Does that extend to Hemingway's thoughts and intentions too?  Does it matter?  It's historical and I want to read it.  Reading the racist language does not mean I agree with the racist language.  Am I glad it's in print and publishers didn't decide that the best thing for me was that I couldn't read it?  Yes, I'm glad.

But "Comics aren't literature!"  Aren't they?
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Eric Jansen
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Posted: 11 January 2019 at 6:53am | IP Logged | 11 post reply

The mentions of Disney's "The Song of the South" bring to mind something else.  A friend of mine (a big Disney fan) would often tell me that when he worked in a video store in his youth, black families would rent "Song of the South" more than anything.  They really seemed to love it.  Of course, then Disney--probably WHITE executives--decided it was racist and pulled it from distribution.  So, the black people that loved it and were glad to have a Disney film that spoke to them were now denied one...until (yawn) 2009's "The Princess and the Frog"--made 63 years after "Song"!

Sometimes, censorship (even self-censorship, when overdone) has unintended consequences.
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Brian Hague
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Posted: 11 January 2019 at 9:05am | IP Logged | 12 post reply

Here's a thought... perhaps those happy black folk of your friend's youth were renting "Song of the South" to see people onscreen who looked like them and hear some of their own stories. The more films that provide that, the less they'll be left to rely on backwards, patronizing examples like "Song." 

Publishers are constantly deciding what they will and will not provide the public. Is it censorship every time they do so? Are they a secret nanny state making decisions as to what is best for us and what we can or cannot handle, or are they looking at the bottom line? Are they obligated to provide us with everything we stamp our feet and demand, no matter how small a group we are? Is "Song of the South" going to please more customers than it is going to offend? Does Disney owe it to us to give us something so many find slanted and unfair? "We want happy smiling slaves! We want happy smiling slaves!" Come on, everyone! Join in with Eric. "Tar Baby! Tar Baby! Tar Baby!!"

I get that you want to decide the issue of suitability for yourself, Eric, but the rest of us aren't obligated to provide you with that. Disney doesn't have to tick off an entire segment of the population so you can decide that maybe it just wasn't your cup of tea after all. (See also: Definitions of "entitlement.")

Ideally, yes, everything ever done would be available to everyone everywhere and what is offensive would fall away due to disinterest and its own inherent failings. That's not how it is, however. So long as profits are associated with the production of intellectual properties, some will remain on view while others do not based on decisions made by executives and accountants. No one is nannying you and keeping the bad stuff away so it doesn't hurt you. If they thought it would sell and be worth the pain in the ass of selling it, they likely would. 

Even then, however, there would still be the question of whether the film is something they themselves feel good about distributing today. You claim Disney is making black people sad by withholding a beloved cultural treasure from them? And know this to be true because, well, your friend told you, so it must be. I don't know. I can see a reason for it to be out there and it even finding audiences among different segments of the population, not just the racists sitting back and saying, "See..? Just like I told you... That's just how those people are..." 

Are there enough people who want it to justify a re-issue? I don't think so. If you do, there are European copies available through different distributors, and those VHS tapes are still floating around. Rather than insisting Disney deliver it to your hand, you could try going out and finding it yourself.

As for The Monster Society being comics' first big epic? You're apt to be disappointed. It was a serialized story taking place over many issues, true, with story developments along the way, but really not different in tone or structure from the rest of the Captain Marvel output of the time. You're likely to find more that seems "epic" in the Sub-Mariner/ Human Torch battles of a few years earlier; subsea armies attacking New York and the like. 

The Monster Society was not reprinted in the Archives, by the way. As pointed out earlier by someone else, the Archives weirdly focused on the character's earliest days, before the humor and general approach were set. As such, they're scratchy, hyperkinetic action one-offs, no different than most Golden Age stuff. Being unspectacular and generally lacking in charm, readers didn't go for them and the line stopped. A few Marvel Family volumes were put out and represent what was to come a good deal better, but the Monster Society was still a ways off in the publishing order. 

The volume that people talk about was put out by an independent distributor, the American Nostalgia Library, back in 1989. It does not feature Captain Marvel in the name or on the book jacket. It had a small print run and is pricey today, no question about it. The reason it was possible for the publisher to do it was because many of Fawcett's copyrights were left unprotected after the company went out of business. No one owns those stories, and so... and this point has been made before, but bears repeating... you can find the entirety of the Monster Society story right now, this very minute, on line. You can go there directly and read the whole thing. 

Comic's first, long-running serialized story. Right there. Right now. No one is standing between you and it. It's not some shady bootleg you can't tell your family about. The copyrights are lapsed. Go. Enjoy.

While you're there, look around for the stories where, as a sales boosting stunt, Billy went to different cities and met their mayors and representatives. Check out the ones where Billy and Steamboat visit his family in the South and get involved in voodoo. Really. Those are legally available as well at this time. Will they always be? Probably not. Laws change or we wouldn't need lawmakers. (Technically, we don't need lawmakers except for those newest areas of technology and such that crop up. Nonetheless, our society is rotten with 'em.) So don't dawdle or the Nanny State will come an' getcha! Boo!! 


Edited by Brian Hague on 11 January 2019 at 9:13am
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Wallace Sellars
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Posted: 11 January 2019 at 9:28am | IP Logged | 13 post reply

There's never a like button when you need one!
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Brian Hague
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Posted: 11 January 2019 at 9:52am | IP Logged | 14 post reply

Thank you, Wallace!

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John Mariani
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Posted: 11 January 2019 at 10:15am | IP Logged | 15 post reply

Brian Hague raises an issue (which is possibly a bit off-topic, but ...)

" As pointed out earlier by someone else, the Archives weirdly focused on the character's earliest days, before the humor and general approach were set. As such, they're scratchy, hyperkinetic action one-offs, no different than most Golden Age stuff. Being unspectacular and generally lacking in charm, readers didn't go for them and the line stopped."

The need to reprint in chronological order drives me insane! I bought the second volume of the Flash Gordon newspaper strips by Dan Barry and the scholarly introduction kind of rubbished some of the stories in the book but signposted the good stuff that lay ahead. If people don't like the lesser material in this volume, what makes you think they are going to buy the next volume?

I applaud Marvel's approach to the Epic reprint line. We could debate whether or not they are reprinting the stories in the order we'd like them to, but I'm assuming (always a dangerous thing to do) they are trying to reprint some of the best (or better) eras first to build an audience.

And yes, I am one of those frustrated by the Shazam archives and wish they'd started with the 50's material ...

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Eric Jansen
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Posted: 11 January 2019 at 10:35am | IP Logged | 16 post reply

Join in with Eric. "Tar Baby! Tar Baby! Tar Baby!!"
_______________

Seriously?  Perhaps it wasn't clear, but I haven't seen "Song."  And I haven't read "Monster Society."  But don't let the facts keep Brian Hague from labeling someone a racist.
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Dave Phelps
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Posted: 11 January 2019 at 10:39am | IP Logged | 17 post reply

 Brian Hague wrote:
Where is line drawn? Back there, behind us. We're past it now.


Except that it's not. Song of the South doesn't get released, but Gone With the Wind is available on Blu-Ray.

The argument for getting rid of Confederate statues (or moving them to museums; either one I can agree with) is that it celebrates racism by honoring people who fought tooth and nail to preserve slavery. The argument for keeping statues of otherwise praiseworthy slave owners (e.g. Thomas Jefferson, George Washington) is that we're celebrating what they did to create the country. We'll discuss the warts, but let them keep their monuments.

So it is with pop culture. People want to watch Gone With The Wind for Scarlett O'Hara and Rhett Butler; the "happy slaves" there are an incidental detail, albeit an (extremely) unfortunate one. People want to read the Monster Society of Evil book because it's considered to be a classic Captain Marvel story (YMMV); they're going for the evil green worm, not the racist caricatures. See also Will Eisner's Spirit.    

I don't blame DC for wanting to stay out of the mess. A Golden Age reprint volume would be a 1000 copy seller (tops), which is hardly worth the potential bad press. But I also don't blame fans for being disappointed about it.

(Note that this only applies to reprints of old stories - the fans complaining that Darwyn Cooke handled Ebony wrong in his Spirit run because he didn't make Ebony a racial caricature can pound sand.)
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Brian Hague
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Posted: 11 January 2019 at 2:36pm | IP Logged | 18 post reply

Eric Jansen wrote: "Seriously?  Perhaps it wasn't clear, but I haven't seen "Song."  And I haven't read "Monster Society."  But don't let the facts keep Brian Hague from labeling someone a racist."

Except I didn't. In calling for a reissue of "Song of the South," you're literally asking for them to put out the Uncle Remus story of Br'er Rabbit and the Tar-Baby. It's one of the most infamous stories in the film. Br'er Fox crafts a figure out of turpentine and tar in which Br'er Rabbit becomes trapped. 

This is one of the stories you're asking, Tar-Baby title and all, to be put back on store shelves and into the living rooms of America. How can you not know what's in this thing you think needs to be re-released? It takes no time anymore to look this stuff up.

I'm hoping that I'm not on your "ignore" list. I did not call you a racist, Eric. I mocked what it was you were calling for.

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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 11 January 2019 at 6:35pm | IP Logged | 19 post reply

For what it's worth, Brian, I'd never want to put you on "ignore". You're one of the smartest and funniest people here. There's nothing wrong with a little respectful disagreement, and, frankly, I think it's better to discuss these things than to NOT discuss them.

At the end of the day, none of us here (to my knowledge) can have any real effect on the issue, aside from writing letters expressing opinions in one direction or the other to DC. We all have passionate opinions about these things.

Personally, I don't have a dog in the race, since I had no plans to buy the book. But, as a lover of history, I don't think we should let it have power over us. That said, I can see both sides of the issue, and I'm not going to flat-out say that DC was wrong to do what it did by pulling the book. I just find censorship of content from nearly a century ago worrisome. That something so old could still hold such power over us and cause us to push panic buttons.

If it was a present-day book, that would be a different matter, entirely, I think. YMMV.

Edited by Greg Kirkman on 11 January 2019 at 9:26pm
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Brian Hague
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Posted: 11 January 2019 at 7:57pm | IP Logged | 20 post reply

It's worth a lot to me, Greg, thank you. You're one of the first friends I made on this forum, and, as far down the rabbit hole as I fear you may have gone sometimes on this issue, I know it comes from a sincere and abiding love for the properties involved and not some sort of dark animosity towards others. 

You're still the fellow I'd most want to hang out with from the forum*, even if we shouldn't discuss politics the whole time we're out and about. If nothing else, I really, really want to see your model collection. Man alive, that has got to be amazing... :-) 

But once again, I can't stress this enough. It's not censorship and no one here is owed the book from DC. The material is available online anyway. No one is keeping anyone here from reading it.

No publisher to my knowledge has picked up Michael Fliescher's "Chasing Hairy: A Novel of Sexual Terror" and kept it in print since its initial printing in the 70's. The story of two guys who meet and bond over their mutual hatred of women, the book culminates in their torture, rape, murder, and burning of a young woman they pick up in a bar. 

Is corporate America united in censoring the work, or is it just that no one wants to publish the stupid thing? 

There are no panic buttons being pushed here. It was a bad business call that DC has stepped away from. But hey, by all means, write to tell them they owe you that book. You want that thing delivered to you straightaway. And tell them to send a pizza along with it. As much as they've caused everyone over this, they owe you that as well.

And the races being depicted within, well, damn it, they owe you something as well, don't they? They owe you their tolerance of your curiosity towards the ugly caricatures of them that book contains. They owe you their understanding and a certain level of decorum. They all need to step back and allow themselves to be shown in any manner that amuses you, because hey, no one means anyone any harm here, right? They should suck it up and accept the fresh publication of these insulting, racist portrayals because of... well, history and stuff. 

Damn it, everybody owes you something, don't they?

Seriously, Greg, I do hope our friendship, on-line and tenuous though it may be, survives all of this. You say it would be a different matter entirely if it were a present-day book? Publishing it again would make it a present-day book. It would be on store shelves today. See how that works?

* Don't tell Robbie. 


Edited by Brian Hague on 11 January 2019 at 8:06pm
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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 11 January 2019 at 8:50pm | IP Logged | 21 post reply

It's worth a lot to me, Greg, thank you. You're one of the first friends I made on this forum, and, as far down the rabbit hole as I fear you may have gone sometimes on this issue, I know it comes from a sincere and abiding love for the properties involved and not some sort of dark animosity towards others.
+++++++++++++++

Correct.

Fact of the matter is that my very name translates to "watchful"/"alert". And so I must be, no matter the cost. I believe that education is the best way to prevent the mistakes of history, not suppression. Of course, this book isn't quite at the same level as something like Mein Kampf, and it's not a huge loss if it goes unreprinted.

In regards to the present-day state of the properties I love, I can see the writing on the wall in ways I couldn't even a few years ago, and it frightens me. Everyone needs to chill out and just love this stuff for the sake of loving it. Not politics, not complaining just to complain. Just the pure love of sequential art and storytelling. I think that the medium as we know it may have to burn to the ground for that to happen, and I'm prepared for it, now. The pendulum must swing the other way, even if it takes decades.
++++++++++++

You're still the fellow I'd most want to hang out with from the forum*, even if we shouldn't discuss politics the whole time we're out and about.
++++++++++++++

Why not? Why can't people have a spirited, in-person debate about this stuff? Why can't we try and share our points-of-view and learn from each other. My opinions aren't immutable. Give me well-reasoned arguments (as you so often do), and I'd be happy to consider them.

I can tell you from experience that most in-person conversations I have about these sorts of things rarely involve yelling or anything like that. I really hope I don't give the impression that I'm a frothing-at-the-mouth fanboy. Or--*gasp*--an Alt-Right Nazi. If you're of a rational disposition, I can't imagine things turning into a shouting match.

I've really come to embrace something very, very important, which seems to be slowly disappearing from our culture: We shouldn't automatically dismiss people because we disagree with them on certain things. We cannot and must not fall into the trap of clinging to extremes. It's entirely possible to get along with people even when you disagree with them about politics or comics or whatever. I'm not going to say that a human being is worthless merely because I disagree with them on something. That's a big part of why this country is in danger, right now. There MUST be a sane middleground. Seeing things from different points of view and trying to find common ground is vitally important.
+++++++++

If nothing else, I really, really want to see your model collection. Man alive, that has got to be amazing... :-)
+++++++++

Ah, shucks. It's just a nice little bookcase in my nerd-room! Nothin' to write home about!
++++++++++++

There are no panic buttons being pushed here. It was a bad business call that DC has stepped away from. But hey, by all means, write to tell them they owe you that book. You want that thing delivered to you straightaway. And tell them to send a pizza along with it. As much as they've caused everyone over this, they owe you that as well.




And the races being depicted within, well, damn it, they owe you something as well, don't they? They owe you their tolerance of your curiosity towards the ugly caricatures of them that book contains. They owe you their understanding and a certain level of decorum. They all need to step back and allow themselves to be shown in any manner that amuses you, because hey, no one means anyone any harm here, right? They should suck it up and accept the fresh publication of these insulting, racist portrayals because of... well, history and stuff.




Damn it, everybody owes you something, don't they?




Seriously, Greg, I do hope our friendship, on-line and tenuous though it may be, survives all of this. You say it would be a different matter entirely if it were a present-day book? Publishing it again would make it a present-day book. It would be on store shelves today. See how that works?

+++++++++++

Again, I hear what you're saying. I just try to look at everything from the point-of-view of an unofficial historian. Sometimes we NEED to see horrible things in order to learn from them. I try to think of context and a sense of time and place in everything I read. Of course, it's not my place to judge what sort of damage the publication of such material could cause, or to decide whether such material should be reprinted. I can only speak as an individual consumer, and voice my own reaction to encountering such material.

But, like I said, I wasn't even looking to get this book, anyway, so it's no loss for me.

And, by "present-day book", I was referring to a modern-day creative team, not a reprint of vintage-day material!


Edited by Greg Kirkman on 11 January 2019 at 9:25pm
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David Miller
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Posted: 11 January 2019 at 9:03pm | IP Logged | 22 post reply

If young'n members of this forum take good care of themselves, they may live long enough to see the day when the pendulum swing back the other way. Nobody will bring MONSTER SOCIETY OF EVIL back into print, but rappers might proudly deck out in t-shirts sporting Ebony, Steamboat, and Angelfood McSpade. 

Edited by David Miller on 11 January 2019 at 9:07pm
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Brian Hague
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Joined: 14 November 2006
Posts: 7942
Posted: 11 January 2019 at 9:36pm | IP Logged | 23 post reply

I know what you meant by "present-day book," Greg, and I maintain that a modern reprinting of Monster Society perpetuates the offense being offered regardless of its original date of publication. We know what's in it. You can read it in its entirety online. Nothing of its history has been lost. Nothing is being "suppressed." You want to watch out for something as your name suggests? Watch out for your own use of trigger phrases and extremism. 

We're not going to guard against repeating history, in this case the publication of ugly and offensive material, by repeating history. We're not going stop the perpetuation of stereotypes by perpetuating stereotypes. You want a trigger phrase? We're not going to stop evil by reprinting and reselling evil.

BTW, one bookcase? Forget it. We're not hanging out.

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Greg Kirkman
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Joined: 12 May 2006
Location: United States
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Posted: 11 January 2019 at 10:00pm | IP Logged | 24 post reply

Fair enough, Brian. I freely admit that youíre more knowledgeable about all of this than I am. And I freely admit that youíre a smarter person than I. Iím a guppy whoís always wandering out of his depth into the ocean, and I look up to you, even when we donít agree. 

I havenít picked this particular hill to die on, or anything. I certainly would never say that youíre flat-out wrong about it. Perhaps Iím totally wrong. Perhaps not. Iíve been wrong about a lot of things, over the years, and Iím sure Iíll be wrong about even more things, down the road. Maybe it all just comes down to point of view. But, yíknow, what? Your words are convincing. Iím not so entrenched that I canít turn my thinking cap around. Thanks for providing food for thought. 

Thereís probably no easy answer to this. Of course, I have zero power or influence in the matter, since I donít work at DC, and am therefore in no position to order the distribution of this material. Nor am I running around saying that it ďmustĒ be distributed. It is what it is, and life goes on. The book is cancelled, and weíre just having a civil discussion about whether or not it was the right call. There are worse things in the world to worry about, after all. So, having said my piece, Iím bowing out. 

Letís all just try to be nice to people, both out in the real world, and here! Bring as much joy and humor as you can to the world. Thatís where positive change really begins. 
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Brian Hague
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Joined: 14 November 2006
Posts: 7942
Posted: 12 January 2019 at 11:24am | IP Logged | 25 post reply

Greg, I appreciate the compliments, I really do. I've been knocked out by your posts many times in the past here. And I agree with your summation that we all need to be a bit nicer and more considerate of one another. It's trickier than it seems, and yes, maintaining a sense of humor and as you say, joy, is a good way of going about it. Be kind.

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