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John Byrne
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Posted: 16 April 2019 at 7:33pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

Klyden is trapped in a way that has been familiar to many people throughout human history. It takes a tremendous surge of societal willpower to overturn longstanding prejudices, since doing so forces people to accept that they have been “living a lie” their whole lives.
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Shane Matlock
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Posted: 18 April 2019 at 3:30pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

As much of a bigoted misogynist Klyden is and how much I've hated him at times, I have a hard time just completely writing him off as a character. Though it does seem like Klyden and Bortus are destined for a divorce/murder if Klyden is not able to get out of the trap of his cultural prejudices. 
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Brian Miller
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Posted: 18 April 2019 at 6:13pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

I’m ready for Klyden to be gone. He’s the WORST. 
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Laren Farmer
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Posted: 18 April 2019 at 7:42pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

Been watching tonight's episode and thinking what an interesting and thoughtful type of story to tell...until the scene at the dance club which caused me to laugh hysterically. 

Love this show. 
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John Byrne
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Posted: 18 April 2019 at 8:31pm | IP Logged | 5 post reply

...oh boy...
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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 18 April 2019 at 10:31pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

This one was definitely a riff on TNG’s “Second Chances”, with Ed in the Deanna Troi role, since he was dealing with the possibility of a relationship with a version of an ex who was still ga-ga over him. In this case, of course, time-travel was the cause of the duplication, rather than a transporter accident.

I think this was definitely one of the weakest entries in the entire series, but I will give kudos to Palicki for making the two Kellys distinctly different in subtle ways, particularly her voice. I can’t tell if they employed any CG de-aging techniques. Might all have been accomplished through makeup, hair, and variations in her performance. 


Some fun and thoughtful moments, but the whole thing felt rather “meh”.


That ending was more than a bit odd, too, but I think the implication was that it really WAS a divergent timeline, and that the memory wipe didn’t take. So, there will be no consequences to “our” timeline, but the divergent timeline will turn out very differently, and may very well end up being revisited down the road.

If the show gets another season, that is!
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Laren Farmer
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 12:09am | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Greg, I enjoy your posts but you must fight the urge to compare THE ORVILLE to some little known and vastly inferior show from years ago.

Okay...maybe it wasn't 'little known'.


Edited by Laren Farmer on 19 April 2019 at 12:24am
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John Harrison
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 1:47am | IP Logged | 8 post reply

I thought it was a beautifully done episode really one of my favorites.  If the ending is a riff on Yesterday's Enterprise then it should get interesting.  Sorry Lauren but my first thought was of Second Chances as well.  The whole show is basically a love letter to TNG.  Still waiting on Will Wheaton to appear so they can recreate the hallway scene he and Scott Grimes shared in TNG.  

Palicki really did a convincing job with the younger Kelly also enjoyed the moment between older Kelly and the Doctor.

The club scene also reminded me of Friends when Ross dated the younger girl that wore him out.  Nice to see Bortis and Klyden acting like a couple having fun  

If JB is quoting Quantum Leap that made me chuckle 
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Doug Centers
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 3:36am | IP Logged | 9 post reply

I had fun with this episode. Thank dog I don't know TNG like I know TOS!

After Dr. Finn's talk with present day Kelly, I wonder if she purposely allowed the mind wipe to fail.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 4:06am | IP Logged | 10 post reply

If JB is quoting Quantum Leap...

•••

Nope. Didn’t even think about it. Sorry!

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Shane Matlock
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 5:40am | IP Logged | 11 post reply

Really great acting job by Adrianne Palicki in this episode. I didn't find the episode weak at all but I definitely got shades of the second Riker from TNG, so it was good to see her actually get sent back in time rather than go the course that TNG went with it.

Edited by Shane Matlock on 19 April 2019 at 5:41am
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John Byrne
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 5:52am | IP Logged | 12 post reply

One of the few TNG episodes I have seen all the way thru was the twin Riker story, so I also saw similarities.

Altogether, I give it a thumbs up. Time travel is my favorite motif, as many of you know, so I don't react well to most time travel stories, which are usually poorly thought out. This one wasn't one of those.

According to the synopsis on the IMDb, next week "the crew must contend with the disastrous fallout from Kelly's decision." Hence my "oh boy".

Alan Sherman

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Shane Matlock
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 6:35am | IP Logged | 13 post reply

I was wondering if that would have repercussions on the present or not. Glad they went that way rather than just writing it off as a separate timeline.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 6:47am | IP Logged | 14 post reply

This is where we get to the trickiest part of time travel: if the Past is changed, does anyone in the Present know?

I once addled the brain of one of the stoners at College when I pointed out to him that we really have no way of knowing that the world in which we awoke this morning isn't completely different from the one in which we went to sleep last night.

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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 9:41am | IP Logged | 15 post reply

Really great acting job by Adrianne Palicki in this episode. I didn't find the episode weak at all but I definitely got shades of the second Riker from TNG, so it was good to see her actually get sent back in time rather than go the course that TNG went with it.
++++++++

I dunno. I engaged with the episode on an intellectual level, but it just didn’t hook me like it should have. I think maybe because it felt very much like the bottle show that it likely is, and because of the very direct port of the TNG episode’s plot. But it has a lot of good character moments, and Palicki did a great job with the dual roles. Maybe I just need to see how next week’s episode plays out to fully appreciate it. The ending felt more than a little abrupt, probably because the episode didn’t really call itself out as being either a standalone or Part One of a season-ending two-parter. It felt very much like a standalone, but it apparently isn’t.

I know that the show is essentially MacFarlane’s fan-turned-pro riff on TNG. I know that they’re occasionally taking “inspiration” from old TREK stories so they can play around with the old story concepts in new and different ways. That’s not innately a bad thing. However, I find myself appreciating the show more when they try genuinely new things, or explore topics which TREK was unable to for various reasons. This one just felt a little too much like a “search and replace” version of “Second Chances”. Ed even uses that episode’s title when broaching the matter of dating Lt. Grayson to her older counterpart.

I really must point out that I certainly don’t think this is a bad episode. It just left me a bit cold, for whatever reason. Next week’s finale may shift that opinion!


Edited by Greg Kirkman on 19 April 2019 at 9:44am
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John Byrne
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 10:15am | IP Logged | 16 post reply

I’ve been trying to imagine what sort of repercussions Kelly’s decision might have.

We know that the nasty divorce sent Ed into a self-destructive spiral that made his assignment to the Orville a risk for the Union. And we know that it was largely on Kelly’s endorsement that he got the job.

Both of these elements are now removed. So, there would have been no reservations about giving Ed his own command—in fact, since the “prime” timeline had him getting the promotion at the end of his rough post-divorce year, and upon the retirement of the Orville’s previous captain, he might have ended up with an earlier assignment to a different ship!

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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 10:29am | IP Logged | 17 post reply

Maybe Kelly will be the Orville’s Captain!
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Shane Matlock
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 3:05pm | IP Logged | 18 post reply

This is where we get to the trickiest part of time travel: if the Past is changed, does anyone in the Present know?

I once addled the brain of one of the stoners at College when I pointed out to him that we really have no way of knowing that the world in which we awoke this morning isn't completely different from the one in which we went to sleep last night.

*****

I would imagine that the only people in the present that would know would be us, the viewers. Although if the present of The Orville is changed to the point where it's detrimental to the main characters or even beyond that, they will likely have to have to have someone on the crew who remembers the old past (maybe Isaac?) and then attempt some sort of fix, which will likely only make things worse. I can't wait to see next week's episode!

And, Greg, I would like to see the Kelly as Captain scenario!
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Paul Gibney
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 3:10pm | IP Logged | 19 post reply

If past Kelly dumped Ed because she was not mind wiped, then Kelly
will be the one who remembers the previous timeline. And she did read
Future Kelly’s journal.
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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 3:23pm | IP Logged | 20 post reply

And, Greg, I would like to see the Kelly as Captain scenario!
++++++++++

Setting aside the fact that next week's episode is the season finale, and therefore might not the best place to focus on more talky scenes which explore character dynamics, I think a role-reversal for Ed and Kelly would be interesting.

We could well end up seeing Captain Grayson and First Officer (or even lower-ranked) Mercer. Sort of a riff on TNG's "Tapestry", with Ed realizing that the mistakes and pain of the past made him who he is, just as Kelly pointed out to her younger self about herself in this episode.

Edited by Greg Kirkman on 19 April 2019 at 3:23pm
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Shane Matlock
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 3:33pm | IP Logged | 21 post reply

I hope we do get that, Greg. I want to see it. And Paul, that's a good point. So the fix would be to have Kelly who remembers the other timeline and how it turned out be the one make the decision to have her past self get mind wiped for real this time to keep what she caused from happening again. 
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John Byrne
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 5:37pm | IP Logged | 22 post reply

I’ll remind you that it was only post-Kelly that Ed took his nose dive. The first episode established him as having been on a direct course for his own command before the divorce.
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Shane Matlock
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 5:45pm | IP Logged | 23 post reply

So it could very well be Kelly's life that goes much more poorly without Ed in it. I can't wait to see what actually happens. 
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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 7:23pm | IP Logged | 24 post reply

I’ll remind you that it was only post-Kelly that Ed took his nose dive. The first episode established him as having been on a direct course for his own command before the divorce.
+++++++++++

Just spitballing, mind you. Although I could indeed use a refresher on the early episodes. I recently saw the first season DVD set in a store, and was again miffed that there's no Blu-Ray release. The show deserves to be seen in HD, so I'm holding out for a possible two-season set.

That being said, they could just as easily reveal that Ed ended up in some accident or some other relationship which derailed his career after Kelly put a damper on his 9 AM, post-date call. We'll see next week!
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John Byrne
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Posted: 19 April 2019 at 7:35pm | IP Logged | 25 post reply

You’re heading for a Mort Weisinger story. “He’s fated to always become Superman...”
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