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John Byrne
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Posted: 04 July 2018 at 10:34am | IP Logged | 1 post reply

LINK

I see their point, but it prompts a question: should transgender actors only be allowed to play transgender characters?

We seem to be drifting toward a new "ism", if actors are allowed to play only what they themselves actually are.

Thoughts?

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Jim Muir
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Posted: 04 July 2018 at 11:30am | IP Logged | 2 post reply

I get their frustration, but wholeheartedly disagree with their argument.

Straight actors can play gay roles, gay actors can play straight roles,
able bodied actors can play disabled parts, Americans can play British,
brits can play Americans...

It’s called ‘Acting’ for a reason.
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Michael Sommerville
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Posted: 04 July 2018 at 12:23pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

What transgendered Actor is a big enough draw to make the movie profitable or a success. People go to see a Scarlett Johansson film she is a star and a proven box office draw. The two transgendered ladies would not be in the same casting call because they do not have the name recognition. If the part was given to an actor of equal status as the two transgendered ladies the criticism would hold more weight. Hollywood is a business and if you want the money to produce and make a profit what is the better choice Scarlett Johansson, Jamie Clayton, Trace Lysette or Amanda Fuller.

An actor's personal background should have no influence on if they can play a part. Actors do not have to have experienced the life of the characters they play. 


 




Edited by Michael Sommerville on 04 July 2018 at 12:46pm
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Petter Myhr Ness
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Posted: 04 July 2018 at 1:05pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

No, definitely not. Jim took the words right out of my mouth, that it's called acting for a reason. 
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Michael Roberts
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Posted: 04 July 2018 at 1:09pm | IP Logged | 5 post reply

Controversy aside, Johansson seems really miscast:


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James Woodcock
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Posted: 04 July 2018 at 2:29pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

Isn’t this like when Samuel Jackson complained that the lead in GET OUT, while being black, was from Britain & thus should not have got the part. It should have gone to an American actor.

So I assume Jackson has been a Jedi, a one eyed spy & killed by a giant ape like creature.
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Thomas Woods
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Posted: 04 July 2018 at 3:34pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

It can get tricky, first thing that comes to mind is
someone born male, but identifies as a female playing a
female that was born a female. Some can actually look
that part, but what if they don't?

As for the link subject, I am a capitalist, whatever is
going to get the most ticket sales is going to have my
pick.

Edited by Thomas Woods on 04 July 2018 at 3:41pm
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Michael Penn
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Posted: 04 July 2018 at 4:38pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

One of the trans actors stated: "And not only do you play us and steal our narrative and our opportunity but you pat yourselves on the back with trophies and accolades for mimicking what we have lived... so twisted."

Does she mean Jeffrey Tambor's success, for example, is akin to an American white man winning an Oscar for playing Malcolm X or Sitting Bull?
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John Byrne
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Posted: 04 July 2018 at 5:37pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply

When it comes to race swapping, Hollywood's answer is that it's all about the performance. Is this different?
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Thomas Woods
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Posted: 04 July 2018 at 5:52pm | IP Logged | 10 post reply

When it comes to race swapping, Hollywood's answer is
that it's all about the performance. Is this different?

---

Some of that is fine, but some can be annoying. Like
race swapping a historical character just for diversity.

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John Byrne
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Posted: 04 July 2018 at 7:12pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply

Hollywood hides behind "diversity" WAY too often. Consider the first THOR movie, in which two Norse gods became Black and Asian, while two brand new characters were both White.
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Michael Sommerville
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Posted: 04 July 2018 at 8:50pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

That is either some extreme miscasting or an award for makeup and special effects will be warranted
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Didier Yvon Paul Fayolle
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Posted: 04 July 2018 at 9:06pm | IP Logged | 13 post reply

Canadians cannot play French people!... So...

And we have plenty of talented actors and actresses in
France willing to have a shot at Hollywood...
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Matt Reed
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Posted: 05 July 2018 at 12:07am | IP Logged | 14 post reply

 Jim Muir wrote:
I get their frustration, but wholeheartedly disagree with their argument.

Straight actors can play gay roles, gay actors can play straight roles, 
able bodied actors can play disabled parts, Americans can play British, 
brits can play Americans...

It’s called ‘Acting’ for a reason.

But this isn't their argument.  They are saying that when a trans role comes up, they aren't considered. It often goes to a straight (cisgendered) actor.  Insult to injury, they aren't considered for roles where trans isn't even in the description. It's all about getting in the room and they feel they can't even get an invite. So as much as I agree that sexual orientation doesn't preclude you from playing against type (Rock Hudson), that doesn't appear to be the practice in casting. That's their argument.  
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Jim Muir
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Posted: 05 July 2018 at 3:00am | IP Logged | 15 post reply

<<But this isn't their argument. They are saying that
when a trans role comes up, they aren't considered. It
often goes to a straight (cisgendered) actor>>

Clearly that's not fair - but it can hardly come as a
surprise for them. Hollywood (as you'll know more than
most, Matt) is notoriously risk averse. They won't want
to put millions of dollars behind a production with a
lead actor that may offend a large section of the
audience. Been that way for decades, can't see a change
coming anytime soon. Not saying its right, just how it
is.

Which is why - as your excellent Rock Hudson example
shows - there are so few (openly) gay actors in
Hollywood.
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Marc Baptiste
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Posted: 05 July 2018 at 7:51am | IP Logged | 16 post reply

I don't like this FACT anymore than any other member of a minority group does, but progress takes TIME.  

I would like to wave a magic wand and make everything fair and equal immediately, but it does not work that way.

The transgender community, unfortunately, is going to have to go through the same trials as every other minority community.  Hopefully, the TIME they spend in that sometimes torturous road will be lessened and lighter thanks to the sacrifices of the communities that fought before them.

Marc
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Steve De Young
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Posted: 05 July 2018 at 11:00am | IP Logged | 17 post reply

The flipside, here, though, is typecasting.  Once you say, "Trans character can only be played by trans actor" you're also going to end up with a situation where trans actors can only play trans characters.  I would certainly find it problematic for a white actor to be cast as an African-American character.  But I would find it equally problematic if Dwayne Johnson could only be cast as characters who were half African-American and half Samoan.

Perhaps casting 'preferences' might be better than placing limits on actors as to whom they can play.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 05 July 2018 at 1:38pm | IP Logged | 18 post reply

I'll admit to being somewhat confused by the present situation. I'm old enough to remember Christine Jorgensen. To recall the "controversial" episode of MARCUS WELBY, MD that dealt with this topic. I didn't fully grasp what was going on inside these people, but even in my teens I figured if this was what they needed to be happy, so be it. I support their demands, I even applaud their courage.

But I also understood -- and here is where my puzzlement kicks in -- that these were people who wanted to be recognized as what they had become. Not as a man who became a woman, or a woman who became a man, but as a WOMAN, as a MAN.

But now we've seen a "third" setting on the dial. People like Bruce Jenner who are loudly and proudly "transgender".* And who want to be identified as that. Which seems to me to defeat the whole point.

-----------

* Tho he's not, is he? Last I heard, he still hasn't finished the process, which makes him a man in a dress, not a woman. Is there any news on this?

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Byron Graham
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Posted: 05 July 2018 at 2:54pm | IP Logged | 19 post reply

Not that I'm keeping up with Jenner, but in her book THE SECRETS OF MY LIFE she states she had that surgery in January 2017.
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Marc Baptiste
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Posted: 05 July 2018 at 3:00pm | IP Logged | 20 post reply

JB,

This is purely anecdotal, and I have no doubt that I will not make many friends in the transgender community by saying this, but I believe that the the movement towards "trans-identification" as opposed to just identifying as a "WOMAN" or "MAN" has a lot to do with the socio-political struggles and pressures that have ALWAYS come with what is called "passing" (i.e., being seen without question by the casual observer as your newly confirmed gender).  I believe that those in the transgender community are probably experiencing what many minority communities for different reasons, usually experience at some point in their growth - exhaustion!!  

The exhaustion, in this case, being constantly trying to "pass" - which has probably brought the community-at-large to a point where they are now saying... look, let's just put an end to the default position being the Herculean effort of trying pass 24/7 and just embrace the fact that MANY of us will never pass as a cisgender FEMALE or MALE and just be ourselves - in this case transgender.

We also can't discount the fact that the need/desire for political power might have come into play here - and having an identifying/unifying name for your community goes a long way in furtherance of that goal.

Marc


Edited by Marc Baptiste on 05 July 2018 at 10:27pm
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Adam Schulman
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Posted: 09 July 2018 at 3:11pm | IP Logged | 21 post reply

I think the real problem is the difficulty openly trans actors have in getting ANY roles. 

It's difficult enough for openly gay and lesbian (and sometimes bisexual) actors to become successful. There really aren't that many Jane Lynches and Neil Patrick Harrises, both of whom have repeatedly played straight characters (and nobody raised a fuss, and no should have raised a fuss). 
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Adam Schulman
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Posted: 09 July 2018 at 3:13pm | IP Logged | 22 post reply

Note: I agree with JB entirely about race-swapping. Exception: "Mordo" in DOCTOR STRANGE. That wasn't Baron Mordo. That was deliberately a totally different character with (partly) the same name. 
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Rebecca Jansen
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Posted: 13 July 2018 at 9:30pm | IP Logged | 23 post reply

Sometimes I think maybe there are as many different 'genders' as their are human beings. Why 'simplify' even into 'lesbian top in a male body with male parts but female hormones formerly married to a straight woman and had kids but now needs a partially female body but doesn't want more kids plus likes to drive motorcycles and bake pies'? If they are presumably just being who they are, then that's who they are without a checklist of every aspect; want to know something... ask them?

The trajectory of nature seems always to be toward variety and diversity not simplification.

Yes, actor means someone like David Bowie who made me believe he was The Elephant Man without prosthetics. Rock Hudson was another great actor because I thought he was a very attractive straight man for years! Hmmm, but maybe Bette Davis wasn't the great I thought she was though! Maybe she really was just a nasty b****. :^D


Edited by Rebecca Jansen on 13 July 2018 at 9:31pm
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David Miller
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Posted: 13 July 2018 at 11:40pm | IP Logged | 24 post reply

 George Bernard Shaw wrote:
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.

It may be aggravating trying to keep up, and being expected to keep abreast of preferred nomenclature not even the demographic can maintain consensus on, but ultimately people are trying to carve a place for themselves in the world where they're comfortable and happy and loved and respected for themselves, whatever that is; it's messy but will leave the world a better place for us all.  
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Matt Reed
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Posted: 14 July 2018 at 1:31am | IP Logged | 25 post reply

Scarlett Johansson quits trans role after LGBT backlash

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