| Author |
|
Rebecca Jansen
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 February 2018
Location: Canada
Posts: 4499
|
| Posted: 23 June 2018 at 10:51am | IP Logged | 1
|
post reply
|
|
I'll take it on this one. I can't prove there were any kittens killed by the ever so emotive and environmentally sensitive full of love gorilla Koko. However it slipped through for me to see it or read it is long gone. 300lb. creatures who play rough and have a penchant for aggressive nipple grabbing 'love', even with a many thousand word claimed vocabulary, are absolutely wonderful kitten carers. Let's just go with that.
But think about how everything seems to be screened through this one woman 'scientist' who had some great spiritual relationship with Koko. She is the only one who could properly interpret for it, and kept all access strictly to a minimum (and time with kittens also). It spent it's life in captivity with no chance to be a normal gorilla, it's main companion wanted it to pretend to read and make hand gestures so it did. Even supposedly not thinking of itself as human and having expressed somehow sexual infatuation for male humans and demanding to see women's breasts (which some attempted to sue the 'research center' for insisting they comply with). Not science. This is just mostly typical U.S. media junk, even if it did rope in the National Geographic Society. It's astonishing how many oh so sensitive and spiritual people go for it or think they are doing good feeding such nonsense to little kids. Like I say, hasn't there been enough data on Tim Treadwells, guys who 'understood' tigers, and stupid women getting their faces ripped off by beloved pet chimps?
Out of ten thousand exaggerated off pieces full of material dictated by the women behind Koko thew breakthrough gorilla I found a couple critically minded websites. Think about the ten thousand sites though showing an ape quivering it's lip (and rewarded for it with food sometime after, but you aren't told that) when shown a picture of a cat, the WTC, or Robin Williams. Aniamls can't have many of the concepts unique to humans, not because I do or don't want them to, they simply can't anymore than they can imagine the surface of the moon or the cause of an eclipse. When 'she' was given the Turing test it seems to have failed pretty clearly, and computer programs have done much better...
https://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2443/are-gorillas- using-sign-language-really-communicating-with-humans/
https://www.thefullwiki.org/Koko_%28gorilla%29
Think of all the bizarre condolences people have posted for Koko all over the internet since this 'tragic' news while the gorillas are wiped out in their natural habitat (and this woman seemed only to want to raise millions to build some fake reserve for beloved Koko so it could maybe be a mommy, and of course they never crush or kill their offspring because they are so full of 'love'... well actually they do but you don't want to know about that, those are real animals. Let's sell more purple teddy bears with rainbows on them and forget that thousands of bear cubs die in all kinds of ways in the wild. The same wild that some idolize the purity of and die in an abandoned bus in the north, or with their plastic 'ocean' kayaks and 'special understanding').
Silly. I'm out of step with it. I'm glad.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
e-mail
|
| |
Bill Collins
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 26 May 2005
Location: England
Posts: 11247
|
| Posted: 23 June 2018 at 11:43am | IP Logged | 2
|
post reply
|
|
I`m not doubting you, Rebecca, just reporting what i
read!
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Rebecca Jansen
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 February 2018
Location: Canada
Posts: 4499
|
| Posted: 23 June 2018 at 12:31pm | IP Logged | 3
|
post reply
|
|
I'm not mad about anyone here, just the old crank shaking a fist at the internet (and feel-good infotainment) probably. :^)
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
e-mail
|
| |
Jason Czeskleba
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 30 April 2004
Posts: 4548
|
| Posted: 23 June 2018 at 11:56pm | IP Logged | 4
|
post reply
|
|
This article I found doesn't mention anything about dead cats, but it does peel back the layers of bullshit and makes it clear that there was more than a little exaggeration of Koko's communication abilities, comprehension, and intellect by her trainers. It's apparent there was significant anthropomorphism unduly applied to the interpretation of many of her behaviors. It also points out the complete lack of scientific rigor in any "studies" done of her and questions the treatment of apes living in captivity in this manner.
Edited by Jason Czeskleba on 23 June 2018 at 11:56pm
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132240
|
| Posted: 24 June 2018 at 9:01am | IP Logged | 5
|
post reply
|
|
The reality is, until some bright boy comes up with a way to literally read minds, we will have no way of knowing how intelligent other animals are. Even the term "intelligence" is misleading, as what we list under that heading is a composite of accumulated knowledge and personal experience, both of which are very different for non-humans.Not inferior, just different.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Shaun Barry
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 December 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 6832
|
| Posted: 24 June 2018 at 11:51am | IP Logged | 6
|
post reply
|
|
To lighten the topic, William Shatner's recollection of meeting Koko never fails to crack me up:
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
