Author |
|
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 132330
|
Posted: 26 May 2018 at 5:38pm | IP Logged | 1
|
post reply
|
|
LINK
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|
Don Zomberg Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 23 November 2005 Posts: 2355
|
Posted: 26 May 2018 at 6:03pm | IP Logged | 2
|
post reply
|
|
"Hey, maybe we don't have to live our lives bending to the will of tired, old, celibate white guys."
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|
Thomas Woods Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 09 June 2004 Location: United States Posts: 1356
|
Posted: 26 May 2018 at 7:18pm | IP Logged | 3
|
post reply
|
|
Saw an interesting comment on this today.
A woman can opt out of being a mother, but the father can't opt out of being a father.
Should men have an opt out clause of being a father, no visitation rights, financial obligations, etc.? Why is it the women can be the sole arbiters of whether or not to become a mother, but then men are forced by the choice of the mother to become fathers.
Would it be considered progressive to give men an opt out?
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
|
Michael Roberts Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 14816
|
Posted: 26 May 2018 at 7:37pm | IP Logged | 4
|
post reply
|
|
Why is it the women can be the sole arbiters of whether or not to become a mother
-----
Because they have to carry the child for nine months and can't just walk away from the child after it's born unless they abandon it or put it up for adoption.
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|
Thomas Woods Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 09 June 2004 Location: United States Posts: 1356
|
Posted: 26 May 2018 at 7:54pm | IP Logged | 5
|
post reply
|
|
Because they have to carry the child for nine months and can't just walk away from the child after it's born unless they abandon it or put it up for adoption.
---
So should men have an opt out?
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
|
Michael Roberts Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 14816
|
Posted: 26 May 2018 at 8:24pm | IP Logged | 6
|
post reply
|
|
So should men have an opt out?
-----
The actual equivalent to "opting out" would be giving men the power to force women to have an abortion. I don't think anyone on either side is advocating for that. Once the child is born, the parents are responsible for its welfare.
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|
Thomas Woods Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 09 June 2004 Location: United States Posts: 1356
|
Posted: 26 May 2018 at 8:40pm | IP Logged | 7
|
post reply
|
|
The actual equivalent to "opting out" would be giving men the power to force women to have an abortion. I don't think anyone on either side is advocating for that. Once the child is born, the parents are responsible for its welfare.
---
Come on,you know that is crap "giving men the power to force women to have an abortion."
Let's say that a guy is going to be a father and he is all for it, but then they discover the child is going to be severely deformed, no arms or legs. The mother wants to keep it, the father doesn't want to deal with with it.
If it were reversed, the mother could end it right there. Why can't the man opt out? It seems like it would fall in perfectly with progressive thinking that men can choose to not be a father for the same reasons the woman chooses not to be a mother. The financial hit will be too much, the timing is wrong, birth defects, or whatever.
The only difference is the woman has to carry the child for nine months. After that he has to be responsible for its welfare. And yet he is not allowed to have any say in it before that?
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
|
Michael Roberts Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 14816
|
Posted: 26 May 2018 at 8:57pm | IP Logged | 8
|
post reply
|
|
Come on,you know that is crap "giving men the power to force women to have an abortion."
-----
If the child is not born, the parents don't need to support it. If the child is born, the parents need to support it. The choice being made is whether or not the child should be born. Not whether or not a child that is already born should be supported.
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|
Thomas Woods Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 09 June 2004 Location: United States Posts: 1356
|
Posted: 26 May 2018 at 9:58pm | IP Logged | 9
|
post reply
|
|
Looking into this further, it's actually being talked about.
Sweden is considering it for one. And I am seeing feminist comments saying they are all for it.
"I'm a staunch feminist, and I agree with their decision to allow the man a choice to opt out completely. In fact this should be enacted in every western world."
"You ready for this, internet?? Ahem, AS A FEMINIST...I completely support a man's right to opt out of parental rights and child support AS LONG AS the woman has equal right to an abortion. In other words, give men the same window of opportunity, charge the same financial and travel cost of getting an abortion, and once paid, give him a court order banning all future contact with the kid, as well as freedom from support obligations."
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
|
Matt Reed Byrne Robotics Security
Robotmod
Joined: 16 April 2004 Posts: 35735
|
Posted: 26 May 2018 at 11:20pm | IP Logged | 10
|
post reply
|
|
Thomas Woods wrote:
Why can't the man opt out? |
|
|
They do. All the time. There are scores and scores of "fatherless" children, men who have abdicated their role in the upbringing of a child that they fathered be it through traditional means or financial. To say that there isn't already an "opt out" clause for men is myopic to say the least.
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|
James Woodcock Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 September 2007 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 7627
|
Posted: 26 May 2018 at 11:37pm | IP Logged | 11
|
post reply
|
|
Hear, hear Matt. & anyone that works with children knows that this can be devastating to the child.
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
|
Thomas Woods Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 09 June 2004 Location: United States Posts: 1356
|
Posted: 26 May 2018 at 11:56pm | IP Logged | 12
|
post reply
|
|
You know I am talking about laws, not dirtbags who abandon their children.
You also know I am conservative and that my view is that people should have responsibility and not have outs for the consequences of their actions.
A man who doesn't want a child due to his career, not wanting to deal with it, it being the wrong time, or whatever would be called all kinds of negative things, and rightly so.
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
|