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Brian Hague
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Posted: 11 February 2018 at 3:32pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

Brian, is that DCCP the one where Evanier was able to get a page or two from Kirby and a page or two from Toth and then sort assembled it into the issue we saw? 

Matthew, I liked that issue from Kamandi's POV a lot.

Eric, I am right there with you, man...

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Brian O'Neill
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Posted: 11 February 2018 at 5:15pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

'Other Brian';-)...The artwork for the Blackhawk story was by Irv Novick and Dennis Jensen. 
Kirby(with Theakston) and Toth worked on a Challengers of the Unknown team-up in DCCP 84...but that story was written by Bob Rozakis. 
(I could dig up DC CHALLENGE, which I believe had contributions from both artists, as well as Evanier).
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John Byrne
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Posted: 11 February 2018 at 8:49pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

A BIT??
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Robert Bradley
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Posted: 11 February 2018 at 9:18pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

I really love that Avengers (#142-143) story where Thor, Hawkeye and Moondragon go back in time, encounter the Western gunslingers (Kid Colt, the Rawhide Kid, the Ringo Kid, the Two-Gun Kid, the Phantom Rider and the Rawhide Kid) and then take on Kang with the Two-Gun Kid's help.

Also, another favorite is the Fantastic Four's first encounter with Rama-Tut way back in FF #19 and the follow-up story in Doctor Strange #53 where Strange went back to the same event.

And finally, Marvel Two-in-One #4-5 where the Thing and Captain America travel to the 31 century to meet the Guardians of the Galaxy in their second appearance.

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Brian Hague
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Posted: 11 February 2018 at 9:20pm | IP Logged | 5 post reply

Yeah. In "Truth or Death," Illyana is challenged in a game of truth or dare to face her fate and future self and triple dog-dares everyone else to come with her as she takes them from the past to meet their then-present day versions and finds that she herself has died. This lasts three issues.

In Bendis's story, a dis-spirited and dying Hank McCoy wrests the teenage versions of the original X-Men involuntarily out of their place in time and leaves them stranded in the present day to witness the results of the A vs. X crossover and the death of Xavier by a Phoenix-possessed Cyclops. This becomes the set-up for the book going forward.

So, yes, Ben Raab's "Truth or Death" is a bit like what Bendis does. It's also a bit like what Claremont did with the New Mutants back when he had the team meet older, evil, corrupted punk rock versions of themselves via Illyana's stepping circles. Claremont sometimes had teams of X-Men and mutants meeting their alternate selves or corrupted copies of themselves at different places in their timelines such as in Magik and the Exiles.

Raab and Bendis were both following established patterns laid down by Claremont in what they wrote. Mutants frequently faced their older or younger selves and the likelihood of unhappy outcomes, if not outright corruption, in Claremont's psycho-dramas. What Bendis did was drag the original Lee and Kirby kids kicking and screaming into the mix.


Edited by Brian Hague on 11 February 2018 at 9:31pm
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Brian Hague
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Posted: 11 February 2018 at 9:26pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

Robert, that Doctor Strange issue was a fun example of moving freely along the Marvel timeline and not unduly stepping on anyone's toes in the process, in diametric opposition to Bendis's approach later. Of the two, I definitely prefer the former. 

Edited by Brian Hague on 11 February 2018 at 9:30pm
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Adam Schulman
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Posted: 11 February 2018 at 9:54pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

The Rick Veitch time-traveling SWAMP THING story was great fun until Veitch suddenly left it unfinished. (He had a very, very good reason to leave DC -- look it up if you have time.)
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John Byrne
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Posted: 12 February 2018 at 6:24am | IP Logged | 8 post reply

Speaking of historical references, watching WONDER WOMAN the other night, I noticed the DC montage in the opening credits featured all the prominent characters -- in their classic forms. NONE of them looked how they currently look in the movies. In fact, audiences familiar only with the movies would have wondered who that blond guy was in the orange shirt and green tights.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 12 February 2018 at 6:25am | IP Logged | 9 post reply

Cut up... a Jose Luis Garcia-Lopez comic?

••

Why not? It's the ARTIST that matters, not the product.

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Eric Sofer
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Posted: 12 February 2018 at 9:31am | IP Logged | 10 post reply

Mr. Byrne - I did kinda mean to make that a joke. I guess I was a little too subtle (imagine that! ME being subtle!) I'd feel the same outrage about someone cutting up one of your books. And the products are all I'll ever have, unless the opportunity miraculously arises to meet you, Mr. Garcia-Lopez, or others of the remaining classics. (Ramona Fradon, Joe Sinnott, Marie Severin... can't think of too many still on this side of the sod.) However, sir, if you're ever in Greater Cleveland, let me know. Dinner's on me.

Robert B. - Remember that along with the Fantastic Four and Dr. Strange, the West Coast Avengers also got involved in that era. And as you noted, I don't recall anyone stepping on anyone else's toes.

So, extra-temporal occurrences. Well, my first is obviously* Superboy and Supergirl in the future with the Legion of Super-Heroes.

I was amused with Green Lantern being pulled into the 57th/58th century as Pol Manning (and his relationship with Iona Vane might be listed as a "lost love", under another topic.)

I liked the Doc Savage crossovers with Spider-Man and with the Thing and the Human Torch.

The Guardians of the Galaxy were always pretty cool to me*, so I liked the crossovers with The Thing and Captain America, the Defenders, and Thor (although that Thor story was a little pushy. Frozen in an ice block in space? Where'd the WATER come from?) 

The follow up to that Thor story where Korvac/Michael came back to confront the Avengers was a multi-part story that actually had my attention... something like eleven or twelve issues, but it didn't crossover, and it wasn't quite so blatant that I felt slapped in the face with a sea bass.

I really liked Brave and the Bold #192, Batman and Superboy. Mike Barr had his own flavor of Batman which didn't bother me too much... but when Batman encounters his old friend as a boy, the character transition was very pleasurable.

Characters in other times... I think that a Deathlok series set in the 20th century might be interesting - or did they do that? I know that there was a Deathlok body in a Marvel Two-in-One story - drawn beautifully by Mr. Byrne, no less - but it wasn't really Deathlok.

And for a really quirky idea... a lot of religions and belief systems have winged beings as deities. It might have been fun to have a tale where Hawkman and Hawkgirl got transported through time to different eras, creating these myths. There were a lot of ways to do it. In a Hawkman story as part of another plan by I.Q. that backfired again. Or as part of a JLA story against the Time Master. Or even in Brave and the Bold, with Batman, against the Time Lord.

*It's obvious if you know me, anyhow. :)
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Matthew Wilkie
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Posted: 12 February 2018 at 5:11pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply

I have no idea what the comic was but I can recall a panel where Vance Astro meets his younger self and wants to warn him of what is to come, I think. The details are sketchy so I may have not have this quite right.  
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Matthew Wilkie
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Posted: 12 February 2018 at 5:13pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

A BIT??

***

Assuming this was aimed at my POTA comment, JB, let me clarify. This was my ten-year old self who had probably only seen POTA once thought there were similarities when encountering Kamandi in that Batman tale. Of course, I now know there were more than just one or two passing similarities ... 
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