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Anthony J Lombardi
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Posted: 26 April 2017 at 12:59am | IP Logged | 1 post reply

The Dark Phoenix Saga is hallowed ground as far as I'm concerned. It was my introduction to The Uncanny X-Men comics. As well as introducing me to the work of John Byrne. I will not suffer no desecration upon this important part of my childhood.

I'm tempted to say I refuse to have anything to do with a Fox controlled adaptation. But I know my curiosity will get the better of me. So I'll cautiously be dipping my toe into the cold waters.

Once again, Hollywood wins. Their interest is solely in the number of dollars, not the reason they were spent.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~``

They haven't won yet.  I might get interested  but that doesn't mean i'll take the plunge. Like most of the other Superhero films if I decide to watch the upcoming X-Men movie. It will be when it reaches cable.



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John Byrne
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Posted: 26 April 2017 at 6:19am | IP Logged | 2 post reply

Too many times since I came online, lo these many years ago, I have seen people saying they went to see some obviously bad* movie because they "wanted to be sure it was bad," or they "wanted to see how really bad it was."

It was in response to these folk that I first started pointing out that Hollywood counts only the amount of cash, not any thought that went behind spending it. Go see the worst movie ever made, and the money you lay down at the box office is a "YES" vote for that movie.

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Anthony J Lombardi
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Posted: 26 April 2017 at 6:52am | IP Logged | 3 post reply


Too many times since I came online, lo these many years ago, I have seen people saying they went to see some obviously bad* movie because they "wanted to be sure it was bad," or they "wanted to see how really bad it was."

It was in response to these folk that I first started pointing out that Hollywood counts only the amount of cash, not any thought that went behind spending it. Go see the worst movie ever made, and the money you lay down at the box office is a "YES" vote for that movie.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I've noticed that once or twice myself. I just don't get that kind of thinking. I mean sure sometimes watching bad films can be fun. If you're watching them with the right people. Take for example the films of Ed Wood. My kids and I will recite lines from some of his films while watching and have a good laugh. But that's done at home not in some theater. 

I'm not going to let the only voice I have tell the wrong message to Hollywood. You're not getting my money if the product you put out is unacceptable to me.

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John Byrne
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Posted: 26 April 2017 at 7:13am | IP Logged | 4 post reply

The bottom line is that I refuse to see any movie that requires me to "squint."

Here I speak of movies where I am already familiar with the source material, of course. I saw and thoroughly enjoyed JOHN CARTER, completely unaware of how much was changed from Burroughs' original. I saw GOLDFINGER and PLANET OF THE APES before I read the books.

This is how it is with most civilians and comicbook movies, of course. The people who drive the box office on X-MEN and AVENGERS and BATMAN movies are not comicbook fans. Every comic fan in America (indeed, the World) would boycott the next Marvel movie, and Disney would not even notice. So the people who matter who are filling the seats want only to be entertained, and that's why a "Dark Phoenix" movie will probably make a billion dollars.*

__________________

* And I'd like one tenth of one percent of that, please!

(Over the years I have taken some pretty big checks to my various banks, for deposit, but since those banks tend to cater to the "1%" the tellers never even blink. I have to think the imaginary check mentioned above might raise an eyebrow!)

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Wil Overton
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Posted: 26 April 2017 at 7:38am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

If nothing else, I'd like to think you'll be due one of those nice cheques and a decent amount of recognition/credit.
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Bill Collins
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Posted: 26 April 2017 at 7:39am | IP Logged | 6 post reply

There is a certain aspect of human nature,that if a
person sees a `Wet Paint` or `Hot Do Not Touch`
sign,they just HAVE to touch the object the sign is
on,just to be sure.I think it`s this type of person who
willingly goes to a film they have been warned is bad!
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John Byrne
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Posted: 26 April 2017 at 8:11am | IP Logged | 7 post reply

If nothing else, I'd like to think you'll be due one of those nice cheques and a decent amount of recognition/credit.

Thing is, I tend to shun that "recognition." DC and Marvel have invited me to every one of their recent (last 20 years or so) premieres, and I have politely declined. They keep asking, but I really DON'T want to be associated with the product.*

* Think of me as the Mirror Universe Alan Moore. I reject the adaptations of my work -- but I also take the money!

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Michael Penn
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Posted: 26 April 2017 at 8:49am | IP Logged | 8 post reply


 QUOTE:
Go see the worst movie ever made, and the money you lay down at the box office is a "YES" vote for that movie.

Indeed. Why not, furthermore, just wait until any particular comicbook movie may be watched on cable or via streaming, for which services a viewer most likely already pays -- if, that is, morbid curiosity  about such a movie, which you expect to be a clunker, is too hard to resist?
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Charles Valderrama
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Posted: 26 April 2017 at 10:52am | IP Logged | 9 post reply

I've tried my best NOT to pay to see any of the recent Fox "X-Men" films... however when they reach cable i tend to watch just so I can be ready for those people that in conversation say, "how do you know it's bad if you didn't watch it?" *

-C!

* Doesn't happen too often as most of my friends already know I can't stand the Fox "X-Men" adaptations.

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Kevin Brown
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Posted: 29 August 2017 at 7:45pm | IP Logged | 10 post reply


Apparently the director says the movie will be "grounded".


Talk about NOT getting it.  Sheesh...



(edited to merge threads -- Tim)


Edited by Tim O'Neill on 29 August 2017 at 7:50pm
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Tim O'Neill
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Posted: 29 August 2017 at 7:52pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply



Bumping this thread to feature Kevin's link above and merge with the previous thread.  Thanks for the heads-up, Kevin.


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Kevin Brown
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Posted: 29 August 2017 at 8:16pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

Thanks, Tim!
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Peter Martin
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Posted: 29 August 2017 at 9:27pm | IP Logged | 13 post reply

Good to see Kinberg being bumped up directorial duties after his stellar work producing and writing the 2015 Fantastic Four movie.

Caveat to this comment: LINK
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John Byrne
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Posted: 30 August 2017 at 6:51am | IP Logged | 14 post reply

There are ways to "ground" the Dark Pheonix Saga without ripping all its guts out. Problem, tho, is I am not aware of the Phoenix Entity having been properly defined in the FoX-Men version. As noted in the article, when they tried to do it in LAST STAND they made Jean's becoming Dark Phoenix the result of a "character flaw."

Given what we have seen, especially since the "reboot" of DAYS OF FUTURE PAST, there's a helluva lot of groundwork to be laid, unless they choose to go the same route again, ie, a mental breakdown for Jean.

If the backstory on the Dark Phoenix transformation had been set up -- Mastermind, et al -- it would be easy enough to take the story along the same path Chris and I followed, but just now have Dark Phoenix blast off into space. Have her destroy a major city, instead of a star/planet. Don't even need to go to the Moon.

Of course, the mention of Genosha tells me this will have little to do with the story Chris and I told, and a whole lot to do with all the stuff Chris folded into the mix later.

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Michael Penn
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Posted: 30 August 2017 at 7:04am | IP Logged | 15 post reply

JB, did Chris Claremont explain to you when you first began on X-MEN why he changed Marvel Girl to Phoenix and what his plan, if any, was for her character?
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John Byrne
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Posted: 30 August 2017 at 7:57am | IP Logged | 16 post reply

JB, did Chris Claremont explain to you when you first began on X-MEN why he changed Marvel Girl to Phoenix and what his plan, if any, was for her character?

Over the span of her published career, Jean had gotten weaker and weaker. In early issues she was able to lift half a dozen teenage girls who were mobbing Warren. Not long after, we were being told she could lift no more than her own weight. Once Xavier "shared" his power with her, she became primarily a telepath.

Chris and Dave (Cockrum) wanted to boost her powers to something more respectable, and so decided to give her a bath in Cosmic Rays (TAC TAC TAC TAC TAC) to do the job.

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Matthew Wilkie
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Posted: 30 August 2017 at 2:12pm | IP Logged | 17 post reply

Is Jackman slated to appear as Wolverine again or had he said that Logan was his last time in the role; I've lost track. If he does bow out it will be interesting to see if they recast the role or not - given how it was left in the last film, I guess he could be left out - which may be considered a commercial gamble - and bring him back with a new actor. You never know, they might do something crazy like cast a Canadian ... 
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Shane Matlock
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Posted: 30 August 2017 at 6:12pm | IP Logged | 18 post reply

I don't expect this to be very faithful or good, but on the plus side I like the fact that one of my favorite comic book creators ever should get a big paycheck from it. But like a few folks have already said, I don't see how could be any more poorly done than X-Men United did it. Then again, never say never.
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Robert Shepherd
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Posted: 30 August 2017 at 7:26pm | IP Logged | 19 post reply

Is Jackman slated to appear as Wolverine again or had he said that Logan was his last time in the role;

****

He has said that Logan was definitely his last go at Wolverine. Time will tell. And money talks.
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Robert Shepherd
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Posted: 30 August 2017 at 7:28pm | IP Logged | 20 post reply

I think this will be Dark Phoenix in name only. I think it'll be less true to comics than even Days of Future Past.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 31 August 2017 at 6:15am | IP Logged | 21 post reply

A faithful adaptation would require more than three years of story (X-MEN 100 thru 138) to be compressed into about two hours of screen time.

What are the odds?

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John Byrne
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Posted: 31 August 2017 at 6:20am | IP Logged | 22 post reply

I like the fact that one of my favorite comic book creators ever should get a big paycheck from it.

It will be interesting to see what happens. As I have noted, Marvel and DC seem to use entirely different metrics for calculating these things. DC sent me a Very Large Check for my "contributions" to BATMANvSUPERMAN, while Marvel sent me a much smaller check for DAYS OF FUTURE PAST.

The former had some small flashes of my work in it, while the latter (even changed as it was) would not have existed at all without me.

We shall see!*

____________________________

* Assuming we're not wandering in the atomic wasteland by then.

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Michael Penn
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Posted: 31 August 2017 at 7:18am | IP Logged | 23 post reply


 QUOTE:
A faithful adaptation would require more than three years of story (X-MEN 100 thru 138) to be compressed into about two hours of screen time.

They made the little tiny "Hobbit" short story into a ridiculously sprawling three-movie epic -- so it's a shame the full Phoenix tale couldn't be a trilogy.

But, then again, if that HOBBIT cinematic monstrosity is the standard for an adaptation... a thousand times no




Edited by Michael Penn on 31 August 2017 at 7:18am
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John Byrne
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Posted: 31 August 2017 at 7:26am | IP Logged | 24 post reply

I wonder if they will find another way for Wolverine to be the one who actually kills her.
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Matt Hawes
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Posted: 31 August 2017 at 8:33am | IP Logged | 25 post reply

JB's post brings up an interesting question: Will Wolverine be a part of this new film? Supposedly, Hugh Jackman is done with the role after "Logan," so unless they recast the character, this might be the first "X-Men" film without a Wolverine appearance (even in cameo).
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