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Laren Farmer
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 975
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| Posted: 06 May 2017 at 9:06am | IP Logged | 1
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I know that since the Cosmic Cube and the like are involved that everything can be 'reset' eventually...but to me this is something that just isn't right because, it's Captain America.
Demon in a Bottle led to decades of 'Iron Man is a drunk'.
Likewise, Hank Pym became the poster boy for spousal abuse for just as long.
So now...Cosmic Reset Button or not...loud sections of fandom AND too many 'civilians' are going to hear the name Captain America and think: Yeah, he's a Nazi/fascist...that's why he wraps himself in the flag. Captain Alt-Right.
That's what we have to look forward to now...for decades.
Edited by Laren Farmer on 07 May 2017 at 4:44pm
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Brian Hunt
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5178
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| Posted: 06 May 2017 at 8:55pm | IP Logged | 2
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Anthony is right. The length of time that these story
lines drag on is part of the problem.
I just don't have confidence that the status quo will be
established because Marvel hasn't done anything lately
to earn that kind of faith from me. This convoluted
story is set up with a cosmic cube being used to make
him a good guy. His default nature, according to the
current story, is as a Hydra Loyalist. Feh. I have no
interest in this type of "Everything you know is a lie"
story.
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Mike Norris
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4274
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| Posted: 06 May 2017 at 10:07pm | IP Logged | 3
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They keep digging the whole deeper though. Rick Jones has been executed by a firing squad on Cap's orders
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Joe S. Walker
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 605
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| Posted: 07 May 2017 at 6:15am | IP Logged | 4
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"Demon in a Bottle led to decades of 'Iron Man is a drunk'."
And indeed, in Secret Empire one of the other characters - one of his fellow heroes, by the way - casually refers to him as "the drunk".
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132397
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| Posted: 07 May 2017 at 7:37am | IP Logged | 5
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Demon in a Bottle led to decades of "Iron Man is a drunk."•• When I was working on the early, early days of what became SUPERMAN III, one of the attached writers told me -- TOLD me, mind you! -- that Superman could not kiss Lois, because when he did she lost her memory. I tried to impress upon him that he was referencing a very SPECIFIC event in SUPERMAN II, but there was no getting thru to him. The moment had been imprinted on his brain as a Thing Superman Does. This happens with bad writing, especially in comics. The well is really very shallow, and when people return to it again and again and again, they tend to draw the same water a lot.
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Shane Matlock
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 August 2012
Location: United States
Posts: 1760
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| Posted: 07 May 2017 at 12:12pm | IP Logged | 6
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I really hated the way the Superman movies added powers to Superman. As if the comics hadn't added enough already. Throwing his S shield and telekinesis vision? Apparently that mind erasing kiss from Superman II had been used ONCE in the comics in Action Comics #306. But both there and the movie it was never implied that every time he kissed someone it would erase their memories. A silly superpower indeed, but in both cases it was a conscious choice like the fact he can look at people without vaporizing them with his heat vision. The comics have had their fair share of adding goofy powers to Superman over the years too. Super ventriloquism anybody? A huge reason why I loved JB's run (other than the writing and art) on Superman was it took him back to the basics of the powers that mattered.
Edited by Shane Matlock on 07 May 2017 at 12:13pm
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Andrew W. Farago
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 July 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 4077
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| Posted: 08 May 2017 at 1:38pm | IP Logged | 7
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I'm taking it as a big "What If?" that's built on the kind of heel turns that floored me when I watched pro wrestling as a kid. We're seeing that despite his lack of superpowers, if Captain America turned against us, he could literally take over the world in a matter of hours.
Marvel's done the alternate reality, cosmic crossover events before--Infinity Gauntlet, Age of Apocalypse, House of M, Age of Ultron, their recent Secret Wars event--and there's a Cosmic Cube involved, so we're building up toward a likely finish of *almost* everything getting set right at the end. It's really unsettling seeing Cap like this, but if they want him to come out of this as a better, more relevant character firmly in the Chris Evans Cap mold, all the pieces are set up for that to happen.
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Brian Rhodes
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3309
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| Posted: 08 May 2017 at 2:01pm | IP Logged | 8
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A huge reason why I loved JB's run (other than the writing and art) on Superman was it took him back to the basics of the powers that mattered.
Super strength (tempered, but still incredibly strong). Invulnerability. Heat vison. X-Ray vision. Flight*. Super speed*.
*Still faster "than a speeding bullet"...but not light.
And he still needs to...you know...breathe.
No moving planets...or flying to them. No time-traveling.
I enjoyed this "limited" Superman. This almost...Marvel version of the character (meant in a good way). At least...what Marvel characters used to be.
Edited by Brian Rhodes on 09 May 2017 at 3:33pm
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Charles Valderrama
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4726
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| Posted: 09 May 2017 at 9:02am | IP Logged | 9
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Skimming thru the internet forums, I found out that in this Secret Empire storyline, Hydra-Cap lifts Thor’s enchanted hammer, Mjolnir. (It isn't a trick.) Apparently, the definition of "worthiness" will be explored in this story as it pertains to evil Cap wielding Thor's legendary weapon.
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Brian Hunt
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5178
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| Posted: 09 May 2017 at 4:15pm | IP Logged | 10
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I vaguely remember reading a Walt Simonson interview a
long time ago where he mentioned that to him, a viking's
sensibilities would mean that being worthy to lift
Mjolnir had more to do with being a warrior than it did
character.
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Charles Valderrama
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4726
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| Posted: 17 May 2017 at 12:00pm | IP Logged | 11
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Things just became more confusing.... Marvel is trying to "right the ship" it seems... under the guise of a "good, clever story".....
..... another (bearded) Steve Rogers has resurfaced in the story..!!
-C! |
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Laren Farmer
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 975
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| Posted: 17 May 2017 at 12:31pm | IP Logged | 12
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Oh no...it's going to be Cap's version of the clone saga.
Or maybe it will be like the two Superman in in 'Rebirth' and they'll have to merge together to become the real Captain America.
Or it's another Skrull.
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Topic Closed)
