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James Woodcock
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Posted: 05 April 2017 at 8:35am | IP Logged | 1 post reply

So, I'm making my way through TOS and it is clear that the arrow head is NOT the Starfleet insignia but denotes someone assigned to the Enterprise.

So when did this change? ST:TMP?

I assume this is something JB or Greg will know
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John Byrne
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Posted: 05 April 2017 at 9:51am | IP Logged | 2 post reply

When it changed is a trickier question than you might think! Roddenberry did not intend the "arrowhead" to be specific to the Enterprise. In the first pilot we see someone clearly not of Pike's crew sporting the badge. Contextually it's possible to write this off as the Talosians getting it wrong, but, as I say, that was not what Roddenberry had in mind.

The granting of distinctive badges to other ships was actually a mistake, done without Roddenberry's input. It wasn't until the movies that the original intent was restored, prompting fans to concoct the backstory that only Our ship had survived its five year mission, and was being honored with the adoption of its badge for all off Starfleet.

I'm sure Greg can flesh this out.

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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 05 April 2017 at 10:15am | IP Logged | 3 post reply

A few years back, a memo from Bob Justman surfaced (based on the date of the memo, he's referring to Captain Tracey in "The Omega Glory"), which shed some light on the matter. It seems that the Enterprise arrowhead was indeed intended to be a general Starfleet/starship insignia, but Bill Theiss went with different patches for guest characters. The movies and spin-offs went back to the original concept. Me, I dig the individual ship insignias.



TO: Bill Theiss
FROM: Bob Justman
SUBJECT: STARSHIP EMBLEMS
DATE: December 18, 1967

Whilst sitting in Dailies today, it was noticed that a Starship Captain (from another Starship) was wearing an emblem unfamiliar to yours truly. I have checked the occurences out with Mr. Roddenberry, who has reassured me that all Starship personnel wear the Starship emblem that we have established for our Enterprise Crew Members to wear.

Doubtless this situation has arisen due to the fact that a different Starship emblem was used last season on “CHARLIE X”. However, the personnel of that other ship in that show were the equivalent of merchant marine or freighter personnel -- and therefore not entitled to bear this proud insignia on their individual and collective breasts.

Please do not do anything to correct this understandable mistake in the present episode. However, should we have Starfleet personnel in any other episodes, please make certain that they were the proper emblem.

Under penalty of death!

Signed this 18th day of December, in the year of our Lord, 1967, by

ROBERT H. JUSTMAN
Chief Inquisitor

CC: Gene Roddenberry
John M. Lucas
D.C. Fontana
Gregg Peters

RHJ:sts
P.S. A carven “I’m sorry!” will be sufficient.
R.H.J.  




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James Woodcock
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Posted: 05 April 2017 at 10:57am | IP Logged | 4 post reply

See, I knew you two would fix this for me.

Thanks for the insight and wow, I got it the wrong way around.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 05 April 2017 at 11:36am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

For some real fun, google DAN DARE, PROJECT NIMBUS and FRANK BELLAMY and check out the Space Fleet badges!
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James Woodcock
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Posted: 05 April 2017 at 12:37pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

I love DAN DARE
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James Woodcock
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Posted: 05 April 2017 at 1:46pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Slight thread drift into DAN DARE. While a lot about the revivals have been poor to say the least, has anyone looked at the art of Ian Kennedy from the EAGLE revival that happened in the '80's?

I felt he tried to capture the essence of Frank Bellamy in his art
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