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Andrew Bitner
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 7526
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| Posted: 03 March 2014 at 4:55pm | IP Logged | 1
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Although they clashed in Acts of Vengeance, why don't these two have a history of battling each other? Once it got cemented that Magneto was a Holocaust survivor, how would he not consider the Red Skull a "must destroy"? He'd be a mutant Elie Wiesel, the way he was seen in X-Men: First Class. Now, of course, Magneto would have even more reason to seek the Skull's death, considering how he desecrated Xavier's corpse and stole a piece of his brain. Just thinking out loud.
Edited by Andrew Bitner on 03 March 2014 at 4:56pm
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Benny Hasa
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Joined: 12 January 2011
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| Posted: 03 March 2014 at 5:18pm | IP Logged | 2
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Sure. Why not. Only issue is that the Red Skull Magneto has interacted with in the past is long dead. The current one is a clone with no memories past WWII. Still, it makes sense for Magneto to go after him, as the this new Skull has an anti-mutant agenda and as you said desecrated Xavier's corpse.
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Joe Zhang
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Joined: 16 April 2004
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| Posted: 03 March 2014 at 6:20pm | IP Logged | 3
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Magneto is a guy who wants to rule the world. He's not really serious with the Nazi-hunting. In the comics he only went after Baron Strucker. In the First class, only with Sebastian Shaw, with whom he had a personal beef with.
Edited by Joe Zhang on 03 March 2014 at 6:21pm
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Benny Hasa
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| Posted: 03 March 2014 at 6:59pm | IP Logged | 4
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In the First class, only with Sebastian Shaw, with whom he had a personal beef with. ****** I don't remember the exact details, but I think he went after a few other high ranking Nazi's in Argentina and killed them quickly.
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Chris Durnell
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Joined: 26 February 2005
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| Posted: 03 March 2014 at 8:07pm | IP Logged | 5
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I think there was a Classic X-Men back up where Claremont had him do some Nazi hunting on behalf of the US government who then told him not to go after a specific person because he was one of "our" Nazi scientists as opposed to the ones whom the Soviets captured. Outraged, Magneto pretty much went full on villain against humanity after that.
The best way to handle this is to see Magneto as having moved on from whatever wrongs had been done to him and his family due to him becoming a full on mutant supremacist. Why care about Jews, Gypsies, and what not since they were all mere humans?
As such, I don't think he sees the Red Skull as someone worth going after. If he has an easy opportunity to go after him, sure, why not? But it's not something to devote serious resources to do when he has his own plans for world conquest.
This is the first I heard of the second to last sentence in Andrew's post. All I have to say is that I'm glad I stopped reading superhero comics years ago.
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Brian Hague
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Joined: 14 November 2006
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| Posted: 03 March 2014 at 10:02pm | IP Logged | 6
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So is corpse desecration a "thing" at Marvel Now, the way rape was at DC not long ago?
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Andrew W. Farago
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Joined: 19 July 2005
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| Posted: 04 March 2014 at 12:59am | IP Logged | 7
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Magneto's about to get an ongoing monthly series, so maybe they'll touch upon some of this. The main problem with Red Skull vs. Magneto is that it should be a really one-sided battle if you get them in the same room (which is how it played out in their encounter in the Captain America Acts of Vengeance story).
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
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| Posted: 04 March 2014 at 6:50am | IP Logged | 8
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Ya know, if Stan and Jack -- both Jewish, both of the WW2 generation -- had wanted Magneto to be a Jewish freedom fighter, I gots ta think they wouldn't had done this…
But, hey! They only created the character, right? What do they know?
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Carmen Bernardo
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| Posted: 04 March 2014 at 5:25pm | IP Logged | 9
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Any more stuff that I read about what Marvel is doing with the characters these days just bores me. There is no one there that knows how to handle the characters properly after seeing the page JB posted above. (Chris Claremont gets some of the blame, though, for coming up with the origin as a Holocaust survivor when you consider that page.)
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Andrew Bitner
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| Posted: 04 March 2014 at 7:02pm | IP Logged | 10
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I'd thought about how to address the "revelation" that Magneto was a Holocaust survivor. At the time (and still, to be honest), I was waiting for him to say "You BELIEVED me??" But... time has moved on and it seems carved in stone. Some victims want to become the oppressor. Some slaves yearn not for freedom but to trade places with the master. Not inconceivable that Magneto would become the "mutant Hitler" after his traumatic experiences, "never again" being twisted into "never to be allowed/never to be possible." That said, and that the Red Skull is the embodiment of Nazism, if Magneto is now (inexplicably) a Holocaust survivor, it seems like it would be a natural thing for these two to fight viciously and often. Especially now that the Skull has stolen the brain (and powers) of Magneto's oldest frenemy. Given the Skull's newfound target of mutants as an underclass to be persecuted and despised, would it be that strange for him to want Magneto (a Jew no less) dead? I dunno, I think villains can have enemies among the villains as easily as among the heroes when their guiding principles are so far apart.
Edited by Andrew Bitner on 04 March 2014 at 7:03pm
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Jean-Francois Joutel
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| Posted: 05 March 2014 at 12:55pm | IP Logged | 11
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Ya know, if Stan and Jack -- both Jewish, both of the WW2 generation -- had wanted Magneto to be a Jewish freedom fighter, I gots ta think they wouldn't had done this…
------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------
I see your point. At the same time, I kinda see the abused becoming the abuser.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
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| Posted: 05 March 2014 at 2:16pm | IP Logged | 12
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Ya know, if Stan and Jack -- both Jewish, both of the WW2 generation -- had wanted Magneto to be a Jewish freedom fighter, I gots ta think they wouldn't had done this…------------------ I see your point. At the same time, I kinda see the abused becoming the abuser. •• Can you cite a real world example, specific to the Holocaust?
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Topic Closed)
