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Greg Kirkman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 May 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 15775
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| Posted: 10 January 2014 at 11:08pm | IP Logged | 1
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I am ashamed, and excited.
Ashamed, because, despite being a lifelong fan of the Fantastic Four,
I've not read the Lee-Kirby run in its entirety.
(Cue gasps of horror.)
I'm excited because, after nearly 20 years of steady hunting and
buying, I am now embarking on a massive read-though of the first 400
or so issues of FF. The first hundred-odd issues are covered by
Masterworks reprints, and I've finally snagged the original printings of
everything else. I also recently bought the Masterworks reprints of the
solo Human Torch stories from STRANGE TALES. More than 50% off
for the two hardcovers! which means I don't have to wait for the as-as-
yet unpublished softcover Masterworks, or settle for the uncolored
ESSENTIAL book.
I'll be going all out, so this FF-athon will also include the entirety of
MARVEL TWO-IN-ONE and THE THING, as well as LEE AND KIRBY:
THE WONDER YEARS (a.k.a. THE JACK KIRBY COLLECTOR # 58),
COMIC CREATORS ON FANTASTIC FOUR, and THE OFFICIAL
MARVEL INDEX TO THE FANTASTIC FOUR,
My single favorite superhero team is the FF, no question. They are the
wellspring of all that is the Marvel empire, and FF # 1 is
unquestionably the second most important comic book ever published.
I'm positively giddy at the prospect of soaking in all of that history,
complete and in order.
From Lee/Kirby to Thomas/Buscema to some guy named Byrne, and
beyond. Man, I'm excited.
Appropriately, I was up 'till four in the morning reading the first four
issues the other day. Those early stories still crackle with energy and
sheer, unbridled FUN. Reading those issues makes me feel just like I
did way back when I first met the FF, 20-odd years ago. More than
anything else, it's the sheer strength of the characters that sticks out in
those early stories. From the very start, the FF were clearly defined,
and felt like real people.
I honestly don't know where I first met them. Back issues in the quarter
bin? Back issues of MARVEL SAGA in the quarter bin? I do know that
my first off-the-rack issue was # 357, in 1991, and that I also bought the
Marvel Milestone reprints of FF # 1 and # 5 around that same time.
It pains me that the FF aren't as popular as they once were. The
Avengers and the X-Men are all the rage these days, and the less-than-
stellar FF films certainly didn't help with that.
I don't think it's a stretch (pun?) to say that those first hundred issues
might just be the single greatest run of comics, EVER. They may not
have the intricate plotting, realistic dialogue, and kewl "realism" of
today's comics, but those stories--at least the ones I've actually read--
are bursting with more imagination and power than anything else I've
ever read in comics.
So, to open this up to the floor--thoughts on the Fantastic Four?
Favorite stories? Memories? Feel free to chime in with some lovin' for
the First Family of Marvel!
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Rick Senger
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 9685
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| Posted: 11 January 2014 at 12:06am | IP Logged | 2
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Like a lot of people, I read them all out of order, too... but I did read the first six issues first through a paperback published in the 70s. I was immediately and irrevocably mesmerized. 1,2,4 and 5 are just instant classics... 3 and 6 aren't bad, either, but those other four break so much new ground with such creativity and assurance... what awesome villains right out of the chute (Mole Man! Skrulls! Sub-Mariner's return! Dr. Doom!) I don't think any other comic title ever arrived as fully formed and perfect right from the outset. Spider-Man was great right away, too, but we didn't meet his arch-nemesis Green Goblin until 14 and some of the early villains (Chameleon, Vulture, The Living Brain, Electro?) just weren't as compelling for me. Fantastic Four was different and it was high voltage in my hands every issue.
It took me 30 years but I ultimately got the whole orig. run from 1 - 416 (some "Marvel's Greatest Comics" reprints in there to cover some of the really expensive early issues), though the Perez stuff from the 70s and then JB's glorious run and a smattering of late Kirbys were my initial sampling. Filling in the Buscema and earlier Kirbys was the hard part; everything after JB cost basically nothing (and there wasn't much after JB that held my attention). I like 296, some of Simonson and some of Paul Ryan's run, but there's a lot of crap in those later issues. The greatest period (after the first five issues) for me is probably around the mid-40s to 60... The Inhumans, "This Man, This Monster," first Black Panther, The Galactus Trilogy and first Silver Surfer, the great Doom / Surfer story.
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Robert White
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4560
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| Posted: 11 January 2014 at 7:54am | IP Logged | 3
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No need to be "ashamed" Greg. I didn't read all of it myself until I go the Marvel DVD-ROM's. (I had only read Dark Phoenix Saga and Days of Future Past for that matter. I had never read ever single issue of JB's X-Men run) Masterworks were just too expensive when I was younger so there was really no affordable way to read the entire run unless you were loaded.
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Joe Hollon
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 May 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 13695
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| Posted: 11 January 2014 at 8:07am | IP Logged | 4
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I started at issue #1 and read the entire Kirby/Lee run (via MasterWorks and Essentials) about eight years ago or so. It's amazing. The first 20-30 issues introduce a lot of familiar concepts within what would become the Marvel Universe and you really will realize and appreciate that FF is where so much of that stuff was born. In my opinion the art/writing/characterization really hits a stride somewhere around issue 30 and then it's just one unbelievably rockin' and enjoyable story after another for 50 or 60 straight issues. No question in my mind it's one of the two greatest superhero runs ever put to paper (don't make me choose between that and Ditko's Spider-Man!).
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Wallace Sellars
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 May 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 17698
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| Posted: 11 January 2014 at 8:10am | IP Logged | 5
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My single favorite superhero team is the FF, no question.
—
Ditto! The first 100 or so issues of FANTASTIC FOUR comprise the greatest
single run in comic book history!
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133139
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| Posted: 11 January 2014 at 8:17am | IP Logged | 6
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As most of you know, I started reading FANTASTIC FOUR with the fifth issue, way back in 1962. It was a time when comics were still looked upon somewhat disdainfully by the general public, and my mother was no exception. As I moved into my teens she, and to a lesser extent my father, put on more and more pressure to convince me it was time I "moved on," that I had become too old for comics.Eventually, circumstances convinced me she was right, and the 32nd issue was my last, until I returned to comics in the early Seventies. Coincidentally, the first issue of FF I picked up was 132. One hundred issues had gone by since my departure, and I found things (no pun!) much changed from what I remembered. Truth to tell, this was not a good time to return to the FF, or comics in general. The Glory Days were behind us, and the Seventies were a time when fans-turned-pro were starting to exert a greater and greater influence on the production of the books. Also, there was an atmosphere of impending doom. "In five years, comics will be gone!" was something of a mantra. A lot of people working in the business just didn't CARE any more, and the product reflected this. Fortunately, I was able to score a huge collection of back issues. I happened to stroll into a local second hand bookstore the day after a fan had liquidated his entire collection, right up to date and beginning, coincidentally again, with FF 32. I spent a weekend reading all the FF issues I had missed. (A word of caution, Greg! I spent the next several days moving thru a world that looked like it had been drawn by Jack Kirby!) Several years later -- tho not as many as if feels like in my memory! -- I was working full time at Marvel, and within a few years of that was given the assignment of writing and drawing FANTASTIC FOUR. (I'd done a few issues as art robot, but they were less than inspired!) The issue with which I began my tenure? 232, of course!! (Those who are into such things might note, my last issue of FF, 32, added up to 5. My return added up to 6, and my first issue as writer/artist added up to 7.)
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Robert Bradley
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 September 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 4860
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| Posted: 11 January 2014 at 8:18am | IP Logged | 7
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I have always had a soft spot for them. I still think FF #48-50 is still the defining moment for Marvel Comics.
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Robert Bradley
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 September 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 4860
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| Posted: 11 January 2014 at 8:25am | IP Logged | 8
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JB - You may feel differently, but I fell that your FF run is your best work. You understood the characters you were writing and took the series in a direction that was appropriate for them, but you weren't afraid to shake things up.
I'd put your run on the FF right up there with the Lee/Kirby run as well as the Lee/Ditko/Romita Spider-Man, Thomas/JBucema & Englehart/Perez Avengers, Thomas/Adams & Claremont/Cockrum/Byrne X-Men and Simonson Thor as my favorite Marvel comics.
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Marcus Hiltz
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 07 September 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 1032
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| Posted: 11 January 2014 at 8:44am | IP Logged | 9
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(Those who are into such things might note, my last issue of FF, 32, added up to 5. My return added up to 6, and my first issue as writer/artist added up to 7.) -- If only your last issue as writer/artist had been 332...!
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Jeff Dyer
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 January 2012
Location: United States
Posts: 143
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| Posted: 11 January 2014 at 8:47am | IP Logged | 10
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My first issue of FF was JB's issue where the Thing burst through the cover..can't recall the number but it was late in his run. In the 280s probably? I loved it...went back and bought all of his run, then went back further and started getting the Marvel Masterworks. I now have all 15 Masterworks which goes thru around 150 I think, then I have issues 200-current. So only 50 issues to get in reprint and I'll have them all! Agree that the Lee-Kirby run is about as good as it gets. I also agree that JB's FF is perhaps his greatest work, but that's just my opinion.
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Jason Mark Hickok
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 February 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 10472
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| Posted: 11 January 2014 at 8:49am | IP Logged | 11
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Enjoy. I've read through the Lee/Kirby issues a couple times and they
are incredible. That period of comic books was almost too good to be
true.
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Greg Kirkman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 May 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 15775
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| Posted: 11 January 2014 at 10:58am | IP Logged | 12
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Up to FF # 7, as well as the first Torch story in STRANGE TALES.
The first Doom story in # 5 is still an all-time favorite. And, thanks to the
gorgeous Sinnott inks, it sticks out like a sore thumb from that early
batch--easily the best-looking of those early issues. If only he'd stayed!
Unlike the early FF issues, the solo Torch stories are a complete blind
spot, for me. I'd never seen or read a single one, 'till now.
It's pretty obvious what the deal was. The original Torch was already an
established big name, and, based on the early FF letter pages, Johnny
looks to have been perhaps the most popular character, initially. So, of
the four, it makes sense that he'd be the one to get his own run.
I must say, it's a bit surreal to see Johnny written in a vacuum, so to
speak, as if he were a solo superhero with a hometown and a secret
identity. The secret identity bit makes no sense, of course. It would
seem that Stan was experimenting with applying that trope to the Torch
simply because it had been a staple of solo superhero stories since the
start. I love how the first issue hand-waves the fact that Johnny's
friends from FF # 4 had graduated and were sworn to secrecy. This
allows for his identity to remain secret, despite the fact that the FF are
both national heroes, and were also the subjects of a nationwide
manhunt in FF# 2!
Ah, the days when strict continuity wasn't such a big freaking
headache!
That all said, aside from MARVEL-TWO-ONE, solo FF books haven't
been all that long-lived. The team/family dynamic is what makes it
work, ultimately.
And I agree that FF might just be JB's best run. I think NEXT MEN is
probably his magnum opus, and other runs might be more technically
polished, but there's so much excitement and love for the FF dripping
off of that run. JB's deep passion for those characters is very clear,
when reading those stories.
(For the record, my first Byrne FF issues were 265, 271, and 278, via
the back issue bins of my youth. I quickly began hunting down the rest,
over the next few years, getting as many as my allowance would allow!)
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Topic Closed)
