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Mark Rand
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Posted: 21 April 2013 at 1:10am | IP Logged | 1  

http://www.supermegamonkey.net/chronocomic/entries/scans/FF22_Forcefield.JPG
The "Fantastic, Not Plastic" thread reminded me of something I've often  wondered about The Invisible Woman's force fields. In FF 286 Jean Grey's telekinetic attack is completely neutralized by Sue's force field. As I understand it,(and it's entirely possible I do not) telekinesis and Sue's force field are both projected invisible forms of energy. Both can move and pick up items, and both can deflect attacks from enemies. My question: Is Sue's force field power really just a form of telekinesis?

Apologies if this subject has been discussed here already 
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Carmen Bernardo
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Posted: 21 April 2013 at 4:10am | IP Logged | 2  

   I always thought it was just a simple force field.  In telekinesis, the effect would be more like a magnetic field that levitates and moves objects, but doesn't affect anything around it.  With the Invisible Woman's power, you've got a force field moving the object that could be detected as a solid object surrounding the moving object, while you couldn't do that with something moving via telekinesis.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 21 April 2013 at 4:40am | IP Logged | 3  

My question: Is Sue's force field power really just a form of telekinesis?

••

It is possible to argue that many super powers are forms of telekinesis. Take Superman's ability to fly, for instance. This is explained as "force of will", but what's that but another way of saying "telekinesis"?

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Mark Rand
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Posted: 21 April 2013 at 12:55pm | IP Logged | 4  


With the Invisible Woman's power, you've got a force field moving the object that could be detected as a solid object surrounding the moving object, while you couldn't do that with something moving via telekinesis.
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This is close to way I've always seen it. The only thing that made me consider the issue further was the ability of telekinesis(and I don't know if this is true of every hero)to block an attack. But your theory makes sense. Especially since I've seen Sue's force field trap oxygen. A trick I don't recall being done with telekinesis.(which of course doesn't mean it's never been written somewhere)



It is possible to argue that many super powers are forms of telekinesis. Take Superman's ability to fly, for instance. This is explained as "force of will", but what's that but another way of saying "telekinesis"?
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Hah! I knew I came to the right place. Thanks John.

I just hope some writer doesn't take that literally and have Superman start doing force choke on Lex Luthor! Although come to think of it...I seem to recall General Zod using pretty blatant telekinesis in Superman 2. Yikes...



Edited by Mark Rand on 21 April 2013 at 12:56pm
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Rick Shepherd
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Posted: 21 April 2013 at 2:00pm | IP Logged | 5  


Sorry to chime in with a dumb aside that does nothing to contribute to the discussion (I'm really terrible for that sort of thing - again, apologies!), but reading the thread title, I couldn't help but be reminded of that classic gag from 'Time Bandits':

"Oh, so that's what an invisible wall looks like!"


...right, that's out of the way - carry on, folks...

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Peter Martin
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Posted: 21 April 2013 at 2:23pm | IP Logged | 6  

A related question, regarding FF #286. Pre-Phoenix  Jean had limited telekinetic and telepathic powers; Phoenix had virtually unlimited power. The returning Marvel Girl was given no telepathic powers, but had her TK power significantly upped. Who decided that?
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John Byrne
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Posted: 21 April 2013 at 5:37pm | IP Logged | 7  

A related question, regarding FF #286. Pre-Phoenix Jean had limited telekinetic and telepathic powers; Phoenix had virtually unlimited power. The returning Marvel Girl was given no telepathic powers, but had her TK power significantly upped. Who decided that?

••

Is that what happened? I was not, unfortunately, involved in what happened to Jean after she was brought back.

It should be remembered, however, that Jean began as "only" a telekinetic, and was later given telepathic powers which were later still retconned as her "sharing" Xavier's power while he was "dead".* Probably, Jean's telepathic powers should have gone away when he came back.

______

* Side Note: Xavier is often referred to as having "faked his own death", but this was not the case. Setting aside the fact that it really was Xavier who died, when the story was published originally, and the whole impersonation by the Changeling was a huge retcon, Xavier's powers do not include precognition. When he swapped places with the Changeling, he had no idea the Changeling would get killed.

One of the elements I was setting up for exploration in HIDDEN YEARS was Bobby Drake's anger that Xavier had "faked his own death", which would, of course, be shown not to be the case.

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Aaron Smith
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Posted: 21 April 2013 at 7:33pm | IP Logged | 8  

Is that what happened? I was not, unfortunately, involved in what happened to Jean after she was brought back.

***

I always assumed it was done to create dramatic tension in the early issues of X-FACTOR, so Jean didn't immediately find out that Scott had married Madelyne while she was believed dead.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 21 April 2013 at 8:29pm | IP Logged | 9  

That's funny! When I did the XHY story in which Ororo appeared there were complaints from some X-Fans that this meeting could not have happened because Jean and Storm made no mention of it in GIANT-SIZED X-MEN 1. Cuz, you know, stopping to say "Havent we met?" in the middle of a battle with a walking island is JUST what people do, and there's no way it could possibly have come up during the multi-hour flight back to Westchester...

So, guessing here no one complained that Scott had not IMMEDIATELY informed Jean of the change in his marital status?

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Don Lockard
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Posted: 21 April 2013 at 10:15pm | IP Logged | 10  

People this uptight need to take a step back and remember they are reading a c-o-m-i-c b-o-o-k =/
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James Revilla
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Posted: 21 April 2013 at 11:13pm | IP Logged | 11  

So, guessing here no one complained that Scott had not IMMEDIATELY informed Jean of the change in his marital status?

How sad is it that this question has to be asked in modern day comic books. Remember when Lois had a crush on Superman and ignored Clark Kent?
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John Byrne
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Posted: 22 April 2013 at 5:11am | IP Logged | 12  

So, guessing here no one complained that Scott had not IMMEDIATELY informed Jean of the change in his marital status?

How sad is it that this question has to be asked in modern day comic books. Remember when Lois had a crush on Superman and ignored Clark Kent?

••

Put it all down to the influx of fans-turned-pro, bringing with them the demand for CHANGE rather than the ILLUSION of change.

Oh, sure, there had been real change in characters before, but more often than not, even that fell more into the category of "illusion of change". As one example, take when Reed Richards and Susan Storm got married. A big deal was made, but did it really CHANGE anything, within the structural dynamic of the Fantastic Four?

But, starting in earnest in the Seventies, there came an increasing demand on the part of fans and what we might call nuPros that there be real and constant change. And much of it was due to a perceived need to pander to longtime readers, those who had been there much longer than the traditional four or five years. Many of those nuPros came from that stable, of course, including me. And I admit I did not step into my role as a comicbook professional with everything all worked out. It took me a while to shed all my fan-think. Sadly, a lot of people didn't shed any of it, or at least not enough.

(Howard Mackie points to the death of Gwen Stacy as one of the most damaging moments in Spider-Man's publishing history, and I agree with him. Peter Parker had had several girlfriends before Gwen. He was one of those "loser" guys who is cursed to keep dating different beautiful women! And if Gwen had been like those others, and had simply drifted out of Peter's life, a great chasm would not have been carved into the landscape. A symbolic Grand Canyon separating Before and After, and creating a reference point which writers seemed unable to avoid. Decades after the death, we were still seeing stories that reflected it, when characters like Liz Allen and Betty Brant had merely faded away.)

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