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Topic: STAR TREK: NEW VISIONS - Origins and Updates Post ReplyPost New Topic
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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 20 February 2017 at 11:09am | IP Logged | 1 post reply

A nice write-up about NEW VISIONS:

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John Byrne
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Posted: 20 February 2017 at 11:11am | IP Logged | 2 post reply

A weight of other projects celebrating the 50th Anniversary squeezed my Kirk/Pike/(TOS movie Kirk) out of the queue temporarily.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 20 February 2017 at 11:17am | IP Logged | 3 post reply

Nice review!
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Aleksandar Petrovic
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Posted: 20 February 2017 at 3:35pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

Nice review indeed. I really like that the reviewer is emphasizing the 'constantly trying new' aspect of it all, which is something that I also appreciate.

Speaking of trying new things, John I am curious about your thoughts regarding the use of transparent speech ballons in photocomics. I am attaching an example from Night Zero (it is freely posted on their site, I just grabbed a screenshot and reduced it in size). 

The traditional white ballons eat a lot of the scenery, but these transparent ones seem far less intrusive. What do you think of this? 

          


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John Byrne
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Posted: 20 February 2017 at 5:30pm | IP Logged | 5 post reply

Your definition of "less intrusive" is very different from mine!

Incidentally, that is easily some of the worst balloon PLACEMENT I've ever seen.

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Aleksandar Petrovic
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Posted: 20 February 2017 at 5:42pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

It is a bit of a hit and miss for sure, but they do play with perspectives a lot, also motion blur (for action), and transparent layers for all kinds of added text (perhaps a better example, attached).

   
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Marten van Wier
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Posted: 20 February 2017 at 7:53pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Mr Byrne, have you ever been tempted to make a follow up to "Space Seed" in which Ceti Alpha V was not turned in a wasteland by the destruction of its neighboring world in order to play with the concept of what kind of society Khan and his followers would set up there?
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John Byrne
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Posted: 20 February 2017 at 7:57pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

Nope.
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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 20 February 2017 at 10:38pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply

I seem to recall your mentioning a certain dissatisfaction with how Khan ended up, though. 

At the very least, even the mighty WRATH OF KHAN still boils down to Kirk Screwed Up, a notion which plagues far too many post-TOS stories. That being said, TWOK is so enjoyable and well-executed that I'm more than happy to overlook it.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 20 February 2017 at 10:44pm | IP Logged | 10 post reply

Web wandering brought me to a site dedicated almost entirely to discussions of NEW VISIONS. Mostly positive, but after a few pages things started to run seriously off the rails as posters began invoking various other comics and novels to support their points. How many people are there who don't understand that none of that material -- including STNV -- is canonical?

(Unfortunately, the site was also peppered with Big Bad Byrne mythology -- you know, like how no one can disagree with me here without getting banned. The religion and politics threads would thin out mighty fast if that were true!)

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John Byrne
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Posted: 20 February 2017 at 10:49pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply

I seem to recall your mentioning a certain dissatisfaction with how Khan ended up, though.

At the very least, even the mighty WRATH OF KHAN still boils down to Kirk Screwed Up, a notion which plagues far too many post-TOS stories. That being said, TWOK is so enjoyable and well-executed that I'm more than happy to overlook it.

I don't recall ever expressing a problem with how Khan "ended up." SPACE SEED has one of the great endings. Milton!

And it's a helluva stretch to say TWOK represents Kirk "screwing up". No way he could have anticipated planetary explosions!

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John Kirk
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Posted: 20 February 2017 at 11:00pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

Screwed up? It's a bit of an overstatement but, sure, I could agree that there was some error. But that's what makes the story accessible and human. In the end, Kirk saves the ship, the crew and the day, but there's a cost. TWOK is my favourite Trek story and it's the fallibility that endears it to me.
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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 20 February 2017 at 11:04pm | IP Logged | 13 post reply

I don't recall ever expressing a problem with how Khan "ended up." SPACE SEED has one of the great endings. Milton!

++++++++

Yeah, even without bringing TWOK into the mix, "Space Seed" is still one of my very favorite episodes. That last scene is just perfect!


Anyway, I was referring to his years in exile and going mad/escaping in TWOK. Coulda sworn you'd said that, while you enjoyed the film, you would have preferred a different fate for Khan. Huh.

+++++++++

And it's a helluva stretch to say TWOK represents Kirk "screwing up". No way he could have anticipated planetary explosions!

+++++++++

Well, I personally don't see it that way, but a lot of people seem to. Khan himself obviously blames Kirk for never checking up on him, but that wasn't necessarily Kirk's responsibility. The only real blame to be placed on Kirk is why he apparently didn't reveal the existence of the colony to Starfleet, so that someone could check on Khan. Maybe he did, and it just slipped through the cracks. Definitely not his fault, in that case! Blame the bureaucracy!

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Aleksandar Petrovic
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Posted: 20 February 2017 at 11:54pm | IP Logged | 14 post reply

I am not sure what site John is referring to (no link), but on that canonicity point - what exactly is Star Trek canon? I understand that New Visions is not canon (which is fine - nothing wrong with having a bubble universe as a sand box), but I am not entirely clear what Star Trek canon is in a way that Disney made it crystal clear for Star Wars.

John, regarding BBB (Big Bad Byrne) - there are people out there who will be critical of what you do regardless of what you actually do at this point, my own investigation revealed that once I became aware of the remarkable level of hostility. For example, there are very few photocomics out there, but only yours is getting flak for being one (for example, the ad noseaum nonsensical "why is it not drawn" argument, which - deliberately of course - misses the whole point). I just hope you will not throw in the towel regading New Visions because of all that (I have a sense that you will not, so this is my lesser worry), and that the negative chorus out there will not result in a destruction of the series by successful suppression of the sales (my more substantial worry).
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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 21 February 2017 at 1:16am | IP Logged | 15 post reply

what exactly is Star Trek canon? I understand that New Visions is not canon (which is fine - nothing wrong with having a bubble universe as a sand box), but I am not entirely clear what Star Trek canon is in a way that Disney made it crystal clear for Star Wars.
+++++++

For many years, Paramount's official stance has been that only the live-action STAR TREK productions (in other words, the five--soon to be six--TV series, and all of the movies, both original and Abramsverse) are canon. THE ANIMATED SERIES is something of a gray area, but still isn't technically considered fully canon, although certain elements have made their way into the filmed productions.

Nothing else is canon--books, comics, etc. I have a huge collection of TREK novels that I've yet to read, and I have no doubt that they contain some wildly-contradictory stories. I've read a bunch of the comics (Gold Key, Marvel, DC, IDW), and trying to reconcile them with both the live-action stuff and each other would be an impossible task!


STAR WARS canon has been much more murky, at least until recently, when Disney wiped the slate clean, and declared that only the movies, the CLONE WARS and REBELS cartoons, and all movies/books/comics from this point on are canon. 

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John Byrne
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Posted: 21 February 2017 at 3:04am | IP Logged | 16 post reply

I cannot imagine myself doing anything STAR TREK related if I had to follow EVERYTHING that had gone before.
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Peter Hicks
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Posted: 21 February 2017 at 9:25am | IP Logged | 17 post reply

To really confuse things, Gene Roddenberry said the animated Star Trek was not cannon (despite his involvement), with the exception of the episode Yesteryear.
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John Kirk
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Posted: 21 February 2017 at 9:28am | IP Logged | 18 post reply

I think John Van Citters is part of the decision-making process when it comes to what is considered canon and what isn't.
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Aleksandar Petrovic
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Posted: 21 February 2017 at 10:25am | IP Logged | 19 post reply

Greg, that was my understanding of Star Trek canon as well (which would make the whole thing similar to pre-Disney Star Wars canon). 

But then I would walk into a comic book shop and see this:


That looks to me like a canon movie tie-in (is it?). If it is, it would imply an ad hoc approach to canon (with different canon status for products within the same medium too - some comics are canon, some are not). If that is the case, there would have to be a list somewhere.
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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 21 February 2017 at 10:34am | IP Logged | 20 post reply

Yeah, the Bad Robot people insist that the movie prequel tie-in comics are canon.

Frankly, I don't think a lot of STAR TREK spin-off novels and comics are good enough to be considered canonical. NEW VISIONS being an exception, of course! There's a long history of badly-written STAR TREK spin-off materials. There are also well-written spin-off materials...which take liberties with the characters and concepts that really wouldn't work, if they were canonized. In other words, fun to read, but not so fun if they're "real".

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John Kirk
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Posted: 21 February 2017 at 10:34am | IP Logged | 21 post reply

Again - john van Citters.
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Aleksandar Petrovic
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Posted: 21 February 2017 at 10:47am | IP Logged | 22 post reply

re: John Van Citters

Is there a Star Trek equivalent of The Lucasfilm Story Group (which is responsible for determining all Star Wars canon)?

p.s.
Isn't that a fantastic way to earn your crust - being a part of that

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John Kirk
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Posted: 21 February 2017 at 10:52am | IP Logged | 23 post reply

Not to my knowledge. But John is a huge fan and is the VP in charge of licensing so he probably gets the lion's share of that job. He did put together the fan film guidelines.
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