Wes wrote: ...This gave me an idea...

Does this fall under "Great minds think alike..."? :-)

JB wrote: ...This is a joke, right? Or have we all forgotten all those retailers bitching because "Storyteller" wouldn't fit the bags or the racks?...

Well, I wasn't one of those retailers, naturally. But, there is a considerable difference in size between the format used for "Storyteller" (usually referred to as "Treasury-Sized") and the standard magazine size I am speaking about. For one thing, there are bags and boards, and boxes produced for magazines, so storage is not an issue. And magazine racks are very common. In fact, more common in most stores (all kinds of stores, that is) than comic book rack and shelves.

Well, those Spectacular Spider-Man magazines from the late '60s sure sparked a revolution, didn't they? And, Heavy Metal, that really got the masses excited about comics. And, boy do MAD and Cracked pack 'em in!

Seriously, I doubt a change in format alone would do the industry any good. People would pick them up in Wal-Mart or Target or Kroger and say, "Eight dollars for a big comic book? I remember when these things were 35 cents!"

My suspicion is that the trade paperback and the movie will continue to be the best alternative forms for a comic book. It probably just one of those media that will wax and wane with the collectibles trends.

It's sad that an art form with as much potential as comics gets ignored, but I think it's something fans and retailers have to live with. The general public just isn't very interested in our hobby in its pure form.

Keith wrote: ...What other factors would stop it from being as widely distributed as any other major magazine?...

Nothing I can think of.

QUOTE: ...Is the creative cost (talent) higher than a normal magazine?...

I doubt it. In fact, if such a plan increased sales, it stands to reason that it would eventually get the talent greater benefits.

QUOTE: ...There might need to be much more space devoted to ads...

There would be. That helps to keep the price reasonable, though. It would not necessarily affect story page count, though.

QUOTE: ...Isn't comic distribution handled very differently than magazine distribution, especially in how they deal with unsold stock?  That could cause a major problem...

I don't think there's really any difference in ordering and returns in regard to comics and magazines. There isn't any difference in the Direct Market, I can tell you.

QUOTE: ...I have to believe, that if Marvel and DC are even halfway competent, that they at least have looked at this idea....

As an outsider, I didn't think that Marvel buying Heroes World and making it a national distributor that sold Marvel comics exclusively was a smart idea, at all. Neither was DC and other publishers signing exclusive contracts with Diamond Comics at the detriment of the distribution system in the direct market. And it was certainly stupid of publishers effectly abandoning the newsstand market in the early 1990s.

You can't always assume that these publishers have thought everything out for themselves. In fact, going by past history, you can assume just the opposite.

Jefferson wrote: ...Well, those Spectacular Spider-Man magazines from the late '60s sure sparked a revolution, didn't they? And, Heavy Metal, that really got the masses excited about comics. And, boy does MAD and Cracked pack 'em in!...

"Spectacular Spider-Man," the magazine, was being sold while you could buy color comics of "Amazing Spider-Man" for 12 cents. If anything, this proves my point about having only one version/format of a monthly comic book.

A modern comic can cost anywhere from $2.95 to $3.99 for the same page count and format, where a magazine will cost anywhere from $4.99 to $7.99 for three -four times as many pages.

"Heavy Metal" is still being published and caters to a select group of fans.

"Mad" magazine sold way better as a magazine than it ever did as a comic book and became a national icon. It is actually still being published, in fact, and is available in more areas than most comic books. There is also a popular TV show based on the comic that has been around for over ten years. It doesn't have the wit or satire that it had when William Gaines was alive and the publisher, but it seems to be chugging along just fine.

What's your point again?

Forgot to address some other points from Jefferson:

Jefferson wrote: ...Seriously, I doubt a change in format alone would do the industry any good. People would pick them up in Wal-Mart or Target or Kroger and say, "Eight dollars for a big comic book? I remember when these things were 35 cents!"...

That isn't already happening with comics as they are now?

Honestly, though, people look upon something the size and thickness of a magazine differently. It's bigger, so the average person looks upon it as if theyt are getting more for their money.

I don't commonly hear people saying, "I remember when 'Time' was only a buck," either.

QUOTE: ...My suspicion is that the trade paperback and the movie will continue to be the best alternative forms for a comic book. It probably just one of those media that will wax and wane with the collectibles trends...

Trades aren't looked at as being expensive?

People will buy trades (which can actually cost more in some instances than the individual issues) without fussing about the price as often (though it happens, believe me) because of that whole psychological thing I mentioned: Bigger, thicker book=More for my money! It isn't necessarily true, but that's the way people think.

I don't think there's really any difference in ordering and returns in regard to comics and magazines. There isn't any difference in the Direct Market, I can tell you.

***********

On the newstand, new comic series or magazines are ordered under a basic mid-to-low quantity with the exception of some items tying in with current trends in other mediums, where larger inital orders are made.  When the 30 day rotation passes (that's what that colored strip at the top of comics used to be used for, as it changed every month), and the next issue comes out, the previous ones are returned and counted (scanned by barcode in most instances) and destroyed at the local distributors.  Affidavits are signed by the distributor verifying the destruction and insure that the books will not be resold, although many escape the shredder and particularly so in the area of comics.  Then the accounting of what was ordered versus what was sold and what was returned results in the order for the subsequent issue.  This can change drastically from month to month and many publishers allow orders to be adjusted up for big sellers.  Of course there is a 90-day period between the order and the printing, just as in the direct market. 

The biggest difference on the newstand was always the cover price as magazines brought better returns as they were more expensive.  This of course starting in the late 60's as magazines made larger jumps in cover price to protect profits and widened the gap of profitablity against comic books.  I think that this was also a reason that comics were still considered children's reading material by so many for all those years.  Cheaper price equaled inferior product to many that thought TIME at 75 cents was obviously more worthy and mature reading material than Superman at 25 cents. 

Comic books have almost completely disappeared at the regional newstand distributor level now as there are hardly no outlets to carry them.  Grocery stores, drug stores, Discount stores and convenience stores all tossed them out in favor of more profitable items years ago and the direct market took over almost completely.  Many people think that it would be easy for a major retailer to take a chance and put up a spinner rack full of comics and watch them sell to a new generation.  But no one wants to waste the money on it and take that chance.  Besides, can you imagine even just a fourth of M*****'s or DC's current monthly output being accepted by the casual reader of today?  Especially with the "comics are for kids" stigma attached? I can just imagine a cashier in a convenience store trying to deal with a screaming parent whose child's new favorite saying is "I'm the Goddamned Batman!", coming from the comic book that was bought there.    

My point is simple. Athough all the magazine/comics that I mentioned had an audience, none of them revolutionized the industry to the point where all, or even many, other comics followed their lead. I don't know that they are drawing many new readers to other comics now. If they were, there would be a lot more of them.

I still think the bottom line is that most people aren't willing to pay very much money for something they consider as juvenile, disposable entertainment, even if that's not what it is. People are always picking up my comics and saying things like, "These things cost three bucks?" I find it hard to believe you have never heard that. I heard it from my family and my friends' families even when comics were 75 cents.

People can justify laying out $3 or whatever for US News because they think they are getting something of lasting, educational value for it. People are willing to shell out almost $100 a year for subscriptions to People magazine because they want to know about celebrity gossip. The average adult isn't willing to pay out $6 or $7 for a lowly comic book, no matter how glossy or how large the format is, because it's still just a comic book. Most people have been trained to think of comics as kid stuff, and they still think that way.

I used to work at a newspaper, and I wrote a column about comics. A city councilwoman came up to me once and asked me, "When are they going to have you write about something more important than comic books?" And she was far from the only one with that attitude.

To sell more comics, the focus has to be on content. We have to somehow get people to realize that the contents of these little pamphlets is as important and relevant as US News or as fun as reading about gossip in People. Then, maybe comics will sell better.

Until then, people will think a bigger comic book is still just a comic book.

I think you are completely right that tade paperbacks sell well because they appear to be something more like a real book. Maybe in the long run, comics will be able to compete better with books than with other magazines.