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Michael Wolner Jr
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 September 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 246
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| Posted: 22 October 2011 at 1:27pm | IP Logged | 1
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I enjoyed it. I think issues 3 and 4 were stronger than issues 1 and 2.
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Ed Love
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 05 October 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 2712
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| Posted: 22 October 2011 at 1:32pm | IP Logged | 2
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I found it to be a fun book and is one of my favorites to just pull down and see some good comicbook superhero action and great match-ups.
I don't think it's perfect, but I don't think anyone could have delivered a JLA-Avengers book that would have satisfied 100% by this point in time. What would have made it better in my eyes would probably have p.o'ed a hundred other fans. In the 1980s when this book was first tried to be put out, the two teams had very manageable sizes with 20 or less ever members each. A tighter and less epic story was possible. The JLA still had ONE incarnation with single versions of its membership without retcons adding or deleting members. One Green Lantern as opposed to the four that were now associated with the team. One Flash instead of three. Aquaman had one costume. Hawkman now looked the same but three different men were now associated with that costume. Instead of just the Justice League of America, you had Justice League, Justice League Europe, Justice League Task Force, Extreme Justice, Justice League International, and God help us, Justice League Antarctica. At least with the Avengers you had just Avengers, West Coast Avengers and the Great Lakes Avengers, but the team underwent so many massive changes and line-ups since the 80s as well (including the three principle Invaders as well as three of the Fantastic Four having served as members). Then you could have gotten away if the team didn't feature cameos of members-for-a-day Phantom Stranger, Captain Comet, Mantis, Black Panther or the Swordsman or mascots Rick Jones and Snapper Carr. But, a present day team-up becomes one of "which version of the teams? which membership? Which version of the characters themselves?" and whatever choice you make people are going to be unsatisfied that their favorite little seen character doesn't make the cut. Go with "whoever is the current team" and you have a book that's going to probably be out of date before it even goes to press given the present environment of the teams changing memberships and history with the direction of the wind. With Perez as artist you have the option to include everybody and have it look good, but then the story requires a certain scale and scope to encompass it. A huge juggling and balancing act, a logistics nightmare and loads of characters who have their fans screaming for more screen time. I'm actually surprised it was as good as it was.
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Brian Miller
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 31284
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| Posted: 22 October 2011 at 1:35pm | IP Logged | 3
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Doug...take a look at these 2 pics...again..just my opinion..but look at the differences between Superman , Thor , Aquaman , etc...Again , i just felt the overall art was not up to par *************** You're asking him to compare two pieces of art that were drawn 20 years apart. OF COURSE they are going to look different. George's style has grown in that time. ( Apparantly, to your dissatifaction.) Would you rather artists' work just stagnate and look the same for ever and ever?
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Brian Miller
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 31284
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| Posted: 22 October 2011 at 1:37pm | IP Logged | 4
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I really enjoyed the series. My only problem with it were the two dimensions. I would rather they occupied the same Earth as all the prior crossovers.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133555
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| Posted: 22 October 2011 at 1:38pm | IP Logged | 5
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I would rather they occupied the same Earth as all the prior crossovers.•• It's been a long time since crossovers were permitted to occupy the same reality. Marvel got a whole miniseries out of it, remember?
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Brian Miller
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 31284
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| Posted: 22 October 2011 at 1:41pm | IP Logged | 6
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Yep. Awful, awful stuff.
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Ben Mcvay
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 18 June 2006
Posts: 1414
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| Posted: 22 October 2011 at 1:43pm | IP Logged | 7
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I own Page 36 from Issue 1 (2nd page in the series to feature characters from both teams IIRC, its the page where WW catches Hawkeye's arrow and the JLA vanish a panel or two later.
I consider this to be the last great thing ever published by Marvel or DC. The artwork is amazing. Heck, Perez got tendonitis drawing the cover to issue 3 (contains every character to ever be a member of either team). His ability as an artist just gets better and better IMO, like JB.
Edited by Ben Mcvay on 22 October 2011 at 2:07pm
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Vinny Valenti
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 8149
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| Posted: 22 October 2011 at 2:26pm | IP Logged | 8
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"Perez got tendonitis drawing the cover to issue 3 (contains every character
to ever be a member of either team)."
---
Which is indicative of just how astray both Marvel and DC have become -
the full roster of the JLA and Avengers were so much smaller by 1983. Heck,
since 2003, both teams' rosters have exploded ever further - Imagine if
Perez were drawing this today, and would have to fit in Wolverine,
Daredevil, Cyborg, Red Arrow, etc?
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Jean-Francois Joutel
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 06 November 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 315
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| Posted: 22 October 2011 at 3:21pm | IP Logged | 9
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I enjoyed JLA/Avengers, but it is a comic I would never lend to my friends.
No characters are introduced; you just have to know who, how and why these people are.
Superman picking up Thor's hammer is great, but a casual reader would have no idea why that is such a special moment. The antagonist is never really given an explication for what he does; if you know his history, you know his modus operandi. Darkseid (I think) is never identified by the heroes, but Hawkeye straight off compares him with another character who doesn't even appear in the series (wink wink).
The story is only enjoyable because of the familiar beats to Contest of the Champions, Crisis on Infinite Earths and other "epic" storylines. If you take the nostalgia out of it, the JLA/Avengers story is a muddled mess.
It might as well have had a sign saying "no new readers allowed".
But it was beautifully illustrated.
Edited by Jean-Francois Joutel on 22 October 2011 at 3:23pm
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Eric Smearman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 02 September 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 5839
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| Posted: 22 October 2011 at 4:07pm | IP Logged | 10
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Jean-Francois pretty much sums it up for me...
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Thomas Moudry
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5060
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| Posted: 22 October 2011 at 4:45pm | IP Logged | 11
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I loved JLA/Avengers from start to finish, but it was definitely not new
reader-friendly.
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Brad Brickley
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 29 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 8290
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| Posted: 22 October 2011 at 5:13pm | IP Logged | 12
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I really like the art, but like others have said, it's not exactly reader friendly. I think it would have been better served with a smaller cast and a more concise story. Keep it simple is my motto.
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