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Eric Russ
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 13 March 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 2006
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| Posted: 11 January 2007 at 3:19pm | IP Logged | 1
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Hi Guys -
I picked up a magazine called Rough Stuff. There was an editorial on
John Romita Jr. In the editorial questions were asked about inkers to
which John (and I am paraphrasing because I don't have the article in
front of me) said that some of the "new generation" of inkers felt his
material is not developed/rendered enough so they have problems
working on his material, whereas artist like Klaus Janson and other "old
school" inkers felt his work was just right.
There are people who say they are influenced by an artist/person of
yesteryear but when it comes down to making a "statement" (for lack of a
better word) the newcomer comes up short of the same standards they
said influenced them. This is not just in terms of the comic art form but
overall entertainment and politics too.
Currently with libraries, schools, bookstores and the internet available it
seems that it would be easier to access knowledge and aspire for more
but for some reason pop culture does not seem to be doing it. Is it
because the “culture” that they are catering to is oblivious themselves?
Are we that numb to aspiring for more? Are we seeking what seems to be
an easier route? When is studying what came before seen as relevant and
at what point does it stop being ignored but embraced?
That all being said is it totally the “new schoolers” fault or is it the person
who came before who did nurture the” new?”
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Jesse Hamm
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 02 December 2006
Posts: 113
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| Posted: 21 January 2007 at 8:28am | IP Logged | 2
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In the case of inkers, I think it's simply a matter of current pencillers "inker-proofing" their work with such precise pencilling that there's little room for the sort of collaboration we see between veterans like JRjr and Janson. Today's inkers are rarely offered pencils as loose as JRjr's, so when such pencils show up on their drawing boards, they're forced to call on skills they haven't had the opportunity to develop.
By the same token, the older generation of inkers appears to struggle when given super-tight pencils to work over.
It's a case of new wine needing new wineskins, and old wine needing old wineskins.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133317
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| Posted: 21 January 2007 at 8:47am | IP Logged | 3
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An inker complained to me once about how "sparse" my pencils were, and how much "extra work" he'd had to do tightening lines and adding textures and blacks. I was momentarily rendered speechless. When my words returned I pointed out to him that the issue he had worked on was breakbdowns, and all that "extra work" was why he had been paid extra money.Terry Austin and I had a conversation a year or so ago in which exactly this kind of thing came up, with Terry expressing his disgust with the "inkers" currently in the field who cannot do anything but trace what the penciler puts on the page. Terry considers himself a "tracer", in the old sense, in which any line the penciler lays down is the line the inker will attempt to reproduce with his own tools -- but Terry also understands that an inker's job (even as a "tracer") often includes tidying up the lines, adding textures, and an assortment of jobs that go well beyond complaining because the penciler has not done the inker's jobs for him.
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Paulo Pereira
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 24 April 2006
Posts: 15539
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| Posted: 21 January 2007 at 9:17am | IP Logged | 4
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QUOTE:
That all being said is it totally the “new schoolers” fault or is it the person
who came before who did nurture the” new?” |
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The answer strongly points to the latter. If what went before clearly worked, then if there's a problem it lies with those who've come later.
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James Hanson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 14 February 2006
Posts: 2396
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| Posted: 21 January 2007 at 9:55am | IP Logged | 5
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-- but Terry also understands that an inker's job (even as a "tracer") often includes tidying up the lines, adding textures, and an assortment of jobs that go well beyond complaining because the penciler has not done the inker's jobs for him.
If a penciller is working that tight, what's even the point of inks? Just scan it into photoshop, turn up the "contrast", and save yourself a comple bucks on an inker.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133317
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| Posted: 21 January 2007 at 10:28am | IP Logged | 6
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Ah, yes --- "digital inking".
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Al Cook
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 December 2004
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| Posted: 21 January 2007 at 11:56am | IP Logged | 7
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"Terry also understands that an inker's job (even as a "tracer") often includes
tidying up the lines, adding textures, and an assortment of jobs that go well
beyond complaining because the penciler has not done the inker's jobs for
him."
One of the things I'd always liked about his work, and about other inkers I've
liked. And probably why I like so little of the inking in books today.
I remember buying the Marvel Try-Out book as a kid, and looking at JR jr.'s
pencils and suddenly having it click as to just why I liked Dan Green's inks
on him so much!
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Sean Hollenhors
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 June 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 722
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| Posted: 21 January 2007 at 1:51pm | IP Logged | 8
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There's a degree of subtleness that digital inking can't achieve. There's
interesting things to be done with digital inking but the tradtional ways
produce a quality of line that has more depth and substance, IMO.
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James Hanson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 14 February 2006
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| Posted: 21 January 2007 at 1:55pm | IP Logged | 9
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I also prefer traditional inking as well. My point was that if the penciller has to draw everythign so tight, so exact, the inker's job is pointless. At that point the penciller should just ink it himself and make a few bucks, if all that's happening is darkening the lines exactly.
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Ted Pugliese
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 05 December 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 7985
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| Posted: 21 January 2007 at 1:58pm | IP Logged | 10
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Ah, yes --- "digital inking".
The wave of the future, no?
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Todd Novak
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 January 2007
Posts: 107
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| Posted: 21 January 2007 at 2:12pm | IP Logged | 11
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I love inking but I've always been afraid to pursue it because I really like
to render the heck out of things. As a layout artist I'm not that great but I
really like to "etch" with ink, pull out the depth, give it form. It seems
strange to me that any inker wouldn't be absolutely thrilled with the
opportunity to pull out the form and make their mark. Why else would
you want to do that job besides a paycheck.
As per digital inking, like digital coloring, the computer is just a tool.
People are relying on that tool to be creative for them. When I draw with a
pencil, I sketch, I erase, I work it so that I get it just right. I do not try to
make pencils look like finished art because that's what ink does best, not
pencils (unless it's a pencil drawing, which is great, but not what finished
comics normally look like). Ink is where the layout is already there and
you can be a little more spontaneous with lines. A lot of the new stuff
looks stiff to me because it looks like it was too controlled. If pencils are
the final product the layout is going to be too controlled and the lines are
going to be too controlled. It's a totally different way of using the brain
that is just, not that interesting and not that inspired. It always comes
down to the traditional skills. Just because we have new tools doesn't
mean we should go back to antiquity.
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Topic Closed)
